Wow, Lance doped

The only thing that surprised me tonight after watching the interview was Oprah's chops!  I was pleasantly surprised by her interviewing ability.  She wasn't going after him like a rabid dog, but she asked good questions with good follow-ups.  I am looking forward to Part 2 tomorrow night.

Lance didn't just lie about doping...he destroyed lives.  There are a lot of folks out there that deserve a chunk of his fortune.  I do believe the guy belongs in jail.

So many people in the general public owe Floyd Landis, Tyler Hamilton, etc., etc. (the list goes on and on), apologies.  Years of bashing...reputations questioned and destroyed...and now, what do former Lance loyalists usually have to say?  "Just move on."    No.  Not enough in my opinion.  The folks who trashed the folks who questioned the great fraud should spend some time apologizing.  Do I think it'll happen?  Nope.  

BrianRunsPhilly - 2013-01-17 6:33 PM I'm shocked and appalled

Dude, out here on the west coast it hasn't been aired yet, now I know the ending,,,, how about putting spoiler in the title rather than the outcome!

I think this is a coin that has more than two sides. I've never been a big lance fan and am not a lance hater now..... I really care very little. He as it sounds was almost like a mafia boss, but a lot of those who's lives he "destroyed" were willing participants in the activity, not all but most were. I'm a lot more outraged at the way the USADA targeted him rightly or wrongly. He was on an even playing filed in all 7 of the TDF with the other riders, which now have no winner because the governing body said they were basically all doing it.

What is the incentive to watch the TDF or pro cycling in the future, 20 years later and you still don't know if the results will stand.

Could you imagine the NFL stripping the NY Giants of their 2012 Super Bowl Championship and denying to give it to New England because they had testimony that some of the players were cheating/doping?

Anyway, I truly care very little but that's my 2 cents...

Oh Brian, I hope you knew that was in jest.

If you believe the top athletes on the tour were clean you are fooling yourself.  Lance beat the French on there own turf, with one testicle, over and over again.

You got that right..

Dude rode Ball to the Wall!

No sweat man.  btw, I suggest you check out the interview.  The "willing participants" you mentioned were riders who were doping.  You seemed to imply that the lives Lance helped destroy kind of had it coming to them because they participated in the illegal activity.  I think that's what you meant.

I think if you look at the situation, you'll see that's probably not what you really think.  Look at what Lance did to them after those riders came out with revelations.  Look at what many folks were saying about "witch-hunting" anti-doping organizations.  How many scornful messages were posted about the French obsession with "trying to take down a good man who has done so much in the fight against cancer?"  How many folks labeled those former riders (who dared speak the truth despite knowing what Armstrong and his team would do to them) as just out to sell books?

My big point is that the guy was ruthless.  He destroyed folks' lives period.  I've never been a "Lance hater..." unless that's what you call someone who just didn't believe his claims of innocence.

It's unfortunate those who backed the guy are so hesitant to post, "Well, I was wrong...I think I learned some lessons from over the last 15 or so years"  Usually, it's, "Just go away Lance."  Or, "Ijust don't want to hear any more." (not good enough imo) 

btw, one more thought.  To say Lance was "on an even playing field with all the other racers" is bunk.  Yes, many, if not most, were probably doping.  But you can't tell me 100% of the riders were doping.  We'll never know where LA would have finished without testosterone, EPO, and cortisone.  THAT is why he was stripped...and the fact we don't know who else was and wasn't doping those years is why nobody else got the titles for those years.

Thankfully, the testing is better...it will never be perfect.  Stringent testing is the only hope ALL pro sports have to retain some sense of integrity.

Nobody said the other competitors were all clean.  

Lance may have had one ball...but he may have had the testosterone of a man with 20 balls!  

Like Kerikadi said, it's not that he doped, most rational people knew that...it was how he treated people throughout the process...and lied, over and over, without guilt or remorse, over a long stretch of time.  He destroyed people financially.  He destroyed peoples' reputations.  He took things from people you can't correct with an apology.  He took things from people that he can't just write a check to correct.

I am not going to call him a despicable human being, but he did some extremely despicable things.

I was "instructed" to Tivo it by da Boss and of course I did and will watch it, it comes on in about 40 minutes here. Otherwise I probably wouldn't watch it.

I didn't mean to imply that I condone what he did, but when you get in and and play with pigs in the mud you are going to get dirty or even hurt. Most of those who "came out" or talked did so because they had either been threatened by the USADA or had been caught.

I could have different feelings about all of this in a couple of hours, we'll see.

I do believe that there were some people who were hurt financially who weren't in the Pig Pen and that is appalling.

Well, before, the old tired Lance defense line was, "They're just out there trying to sell books."

Now, ya hear more of the "well everybody was doing it..." and those folks are failing to see the point.  It's not that he cheated.  It's the ruthless manner in which he conducted matters.  He destroyed people.  He did it seemingly without guilt/remorse.  

You can do a search but I don't think you'll find any post where I've said they did it to sell books. Not always but usually where there is smoke there is fire imo. I understand what you are saying though. I just felt the need to say I'm not one of those,,,,, I'm a lot of things, but not that one.

As I said in my first reply to you he acted as a mafia boss, I chose that analogy for a reason, again (and I feel a little dirty for having to say this two days in a row),,,,,,,,,,,, here we agree.

I watched, and I respect that he didn't name anyone or blame anyone.  Still, I'm not swayed, and I've not made my contempt for him a secret....Luck Fance!

Here's one to think about...

My son is ate up with s/b/r....and he's near the top of the game for his age, just for reference.  I sat down to watch and asked him if he wanted to watch with me,  he's 15.  He said, "no pop, I'm just going to go to bed.  I don't want to watch it, because in the end he'll always have at least one fan, because watching him race got me started."

I respect that too.

Good point. Out of the last 17 TDF wins, 13 of them were won by people who have since been proven to be dopers. That's a pretty sad state of affairs and I think people should be focusing on more than just Lance. He's just a symptom of the much more widespread disease.

Nobody owes Floyd Landis or Tyler Hamilton anything. They both ended up better than they deserved.

Landis does still owe a lot of people for the Floyd Fairness Fund though.

Bingo. You do not get points for doing something when you had NO OTHER CHOICE. Tyler and Floyd milked it as long as they could... and they had NO other choice.... and they did it because they wanter to GAIN something from it. No different that Lance, he had his time to do the right thing.. not when racing, who would have? But certainly the fed investigation, or when USADA said they were going to move forward. When Hincappie told him he testified. And right now... you can be assured LA has something to GAIN from this. He has proven over his life he does nothing that does not serve a purpose.

Say what you  want. Keep supporting him. does not matter. LA will never go away, we just started a new chapter. We'll see when it is all said and done.

Hubby and I watched last night. DH was starting to get soft. I said the same thing as you - of course he is trying to repent now. It is in his best interest.

But, at the end of the day, it is not for me to judge.

Yes, he said he cheated, was he wrong in cheating, yes.  It does not matter if everyone else was cheating or not, he can only account for what he did.  Could he have won without the drugs and doping, we will never know for sure.  Just taking drugs does not make you a winner.  Lance still put in many many miles on the bike and worked very hard.

It was a time when he had testicular cancer and he brought a lot of HOPE to a lot of people with cancer.

Who on this site has never cheated, whether it be breaking the speed limit while driving, drinking and driving, fudging on taxes or whatever.

Personally, I know I have messed up in my life a LOT.  I would hope people would forgive me.

I hope Lance is allowed to compete in future triathlons.

You would never know if anyone is clean or not, so using that justification should you and I should never be allowed to race either? A lot of people do reform.

There are consequences for cheating, but a lifetime ban from competition is excessive. two year bans, 5 year bans (I have no idea what the standard time penalty is) and a special case for LA? No, ruling should be standard for everyone. I don't have a say in that though, didn't LA get a lifetime penalty anyways with the sports federation? I forgot the acronym..