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2014-06-17 2:16 PM

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Hereford, England
Subject: Damn Cyclists Up Ahead!
Why do I always do this!

I went out for a nice, gentle zone 2 ride, which turned into a hard zone 3 ride! I was going to do an hour around 16 MPH, which turned into 19.5 MPH for 33 minutes

A couple of mile in I saw a cyclist up ahead, so I naturally increased my pace to overtake him. That wasn't difficult, but then he tried to latch on to the back of me. Took a mile or two to put a decent distance between us! Then I just carried on pushing it. It was meant to be a bit of a recovery ride from a hard ride yesterday.

I'm not too fussed as, for me, it was a decent effort, and as it's for a mini sprint, I don't mind zone 3 training.


How do you overcome the urge to go too hard in training or races?


2014-06-17 2:20 PM
in reply to: Eucid


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Arden, North Carolina
Subject: RE: Damn Cyclists Up Ahead!
I had just the kind of ride you were aiming for yesterday. I typically plan to go easy and wind up going hard. I tend to start off strong, and feel good, I see my average pace, get excited and try to keep it high, and wind up with an exhausting ride.

Yesterday I just set out with no agenda other than to enjoy the ride(imagine that, having fun during training? who'd of thought) . I didn't even have a route. I just rode, making unplanned turns and just monitoring the time and having a general idea where I was. I thinking riding the unfamiliar territory and seeing new stuff kept my mind occupied and I just enjoyed the ride at a really easy pace.
So that's what worked for me
2014-06-17 2:33 PM
in reply to: TriDadinAsheville

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Master
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Overland Park, KS
Subject: RE: Damn Cyclists Up Ahead!
I wonder if there's anything in the "The Rules" about that.
2014-06-17 2:51 PM
in reply to: Eucid

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Champion
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Sarasota, FL
Subject: RE: Damn Cyclists Up Ahead!

Going slow = boring

Going fast = fun!!!

We spend a lot more of our triathlon lives training than racing.  Sometimes ya just gotta have some fun.  Life's too short not to enjoy it when you can.

Mark

2014-06-17 2:57 PM
in reply to: #5013669

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Expert
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Madison, Wisconsin
Subject: RE: Damn Cyclists Up Ahead!
Lots of people race in zone 3. Specificity
2014-06-17 3:12 PM
in reply to: Eucid

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Is this Heaven? No, it's Iowa.
Subject: RE: Damn Cyclists Up Ahead!

How dare he be on your road?  LOL.  If I see a biker in front of me I take it as a challenge.

Regardless of the plan.....  I'm after it!

 



2014-06-17 3:59 PM
in reply to: Eucid

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Subject: RE: Damn Cyclists Up Ahead!

The only time I really try to resist the urge is when I am running.  Before all my training runs I specify a purpose to the workout and make every attempt to hold to it.  My run training is much more structured and ignoring the purpose of a run can have a negative cumulative effect on what I am trying to accomplish for the week.  For example, an easy recovery day that turns into a rabbit chase might compromise the following days tempo run or long run.

I am much more likely to give in to the urge to chase when I am riding or swimming.  In fact, I think it is good for me to chase on the bike especially as I tend to be rather one dimensional in my bike training.  I usually ride pretty hard but do not do enough higher intensity intervals.  Sometimes it's good to push beyond the comfort zones. 

2014-06-17 4:19 PM
in reply to: popsracer

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Subject: RE: Damn Cyclists Up Ahead!
Originally posted by popsracer

I am much more likely to give in to the urge to chase when I am riding or swimming.  In fact, I think it is good for me to chase on the bike especially as I tend to be rather one dimensional in my bike training.  I usually ride pretty hard but do not do enough higher intensity intervals.  Sometimes it's good to push beyond the comfort zones. 




Heck yes. If there is someone remotely near my pace in the lane next to me I always end up going to war. The only reason I may someday learn how to do flip turns is to keep up with the person next to me.
2014-06-17 4:26 PM
in reply to: jonD81


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Subject: RE: Damn Cyclists Up Ahead!

Not me, usually, unless I specifically go on a hammerfest workout where I'm intentionally going to hammer it. 

 

I find that when I have the correct training volume for my ability, it should be enough that I have no interest in the chase because I'm usually sufficiently beaten down by the other workouts in the week. 

 

The dangerous time is taper weeks, where the legs start to get fresh again, and I'm also avoiding hard long efforts - that's def tough to let the rabbits go by!

 

The swimming lane-racing is always interesting to me. I'd say a good third of the time if there's someone in the next adjacent lane at the pools I swim at near my speed, since I typically do straight 100s or 200 intervals on a steady pace, I'll often see them go from a 2:00/100 recovery style pace to a 1:25/100 pace the moment i start coming by. Sometimes the amount of arm flailage they get is pretty extraordinary - you would never do that (because you'd burn out) if you were doing like 10 x 200 on a rock steady pace and short sendoff, but seems like some folks let their competitive drive take over their workout structure.

2014-06-17 8:26 PM
in reply to: Eucid

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Acworth, GA
Subject: RE: Damn Cyclists Up Ahead!
Originally posted by Eucid

How do you overcome the urge to go too hard in training or races?

I figured that I am mentally better suited for sprints/olys as I like to chase rabbits. So there is really not a "too hard" per se in a sprint distance.

In the only HIM distance I did, I struggled with not chasing other bikers and having to ride with blinders on. It was way too boring for me to just be going through the emotions holding back the effort because I knew that I would have 13 miles to reflect on that poor choice.

That's the only way I have figured it out, I stay away from the longer stuff.
2014-06-17 8:48 PM
in reply to: #5013697

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Subject: RE: Damn Cyclists Up Ahead!
Stupid question... What if it's pace booty up ahead? All bets off then for women and us men? Go hard to catch up? Lol.


2014-06-18 12:51 AM
in reply to: Bevie

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Subject: RE: Damn Cyclists Up Ahead!
on easy rides - I have begun listening to podcasts and that helps keep me from pushing. Simple, but it works. Also tell yourself you are better than that 'wanna be' in front of you and you will prove it on race day! Got to have discipline - now should I wash those shorts or just wear them again? just kidding, I promise. I wore them all last week, I will wash them. ; )
2014-06-18 5:21 AM
in reply to: Eucid

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Subject: RE: Damn Cyclists Up Ahead!
Originally posted by Eucid
How do you overcome the urge to go too hard in training or races?


I don't get that urge and in all honesty I don't understand why someone would have it.

I've got my training plan, the person up ahead has their own training plan. I keep to mine.

I've had days on my tri bike where I hear some younger person on a knobby tire hybrid pant past me and later hear him bellowing about how he wasted me on my race bike. Ummm, my training plan says to stay in a really low zone and let little ol' ladies with their white basket and three flowers pass me as a measure of how slow. Plus you "wasted" me at the end of a 4 hour ride. I don't say anything but I wonder why the hell passing me was so important.

Weird impulses.

2014-06-18 7:59 AM
in reply to: DanielG

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Subject: RE: Damn Cyclists Up Ahead!

Originally posted by DanielG
Originally posted by Eucid How do you overcome the urge to go too hard in training or races?
I don't get that urge and in all honesty I don't understand why someone would have it.

I've got my training plan, the person up ahead has their own training plan. I keep to mine.

I get the urge, but the second part is what I do. Just stay with your plan, learn to keep yourself in control. It can be helpful on race day as well, learning to stay within yourself. People who chase run the risk of blowing up. On days that are supposed to be easy maybe put in some quick stops to look around some, especially if you're picking up the pace. Or shift to an easier gear. Basically, when you feel the urge to push more, change something up to help take yourself out of that situation.

2014-06-18 8:39 AM
in reply to: DanielG


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Subject: RE: Damn Cyclists Up Ahead!

Originally posted by DanielG
Originally posted by Eucid How do you overcome the urge to go too hard in training or races?
I don't get that urge and in all honesty I don't understand why someone would have it. I've got my training plan, the person up ahead has their own training plan. I keep to mine. I've had days on my tri bike where I hear some younger person on a knobby tire hybrid pant past me and later hear him bellowing about how he wasted me on my race bike. Ummm, my training plan says to stay in a really low zone and let little ol' ladies with their white basket and three flowers pass me as a measure of how slow. Plus you "wasted" me at the end of a 4 hour ride. I don't say anything but I wonder why the hell passing me was so important. Weird impulses.

 

Yup, I've got that experience too - have more than once had a bunch of HS-aged kids on mountain bikes blow by me when I was riding back into town, and they usually say something along the lines of 'dude you're SLOW!' Of course, they didn't know the 100 miles I just rode with 10k feet of climbing before they ran into me. 

 

Being competitive and chasing rabbits on training workouts can be fine for the extra oomph, but if it's taking priority over raising your training volume to a higher level because you're wasting so much energy chasing random people, you're not doing it right. If you find yourself chasing every rabbit out there on your workouts, I'd say you have to step back and ask if you're actually training correctly, because you're likely not.

2014-06-18 8:54 AM
in reply to: Eucid

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Greenville, SC
Subject: RE: Damn Cyclists Up Ahead!

I can't do easy rides. I have to get on my trainer and either turn the fan on the lowest setting or leave it off to keep me going easy.  Any time I'm outside it's a tempo, interval, or climbing ride. However, I have perfected the lazy swim and am easily talked into making a run Z1/2.



2014-06-18 9:12 AM
in reply to: Eucid

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Subject: RE: Damn Cyclists Up Ahead!
I did this last week and I was very disappointed when the cyclist turned into a neighborhood before I could overtake him..
2014-06-18 10:06 AM
in reply to: DanielG

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Master
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Bellevue, WA
Subject: RE: Damn Cyclists Up Ahead!

Originally posted by DanielG
Originally posted by Eucid How do you overcome the urge to go too hard in training or races?
I don't get that urge and in all honesty I don't understand why someone would have it. I've got my training plan, the person up ahead has their own training plan. I keep to mine. I've had days on my tri bike where I hear some younger person on a knobby tire hybrid pant past me and later hear him bellowing about how he wasted me on my race bike. Ummm, my training plan says to stay in a really low zone and let little ol' ladies with their white basket and three flowers pass me as a measure of how slow. Plus you "wasted" me at the end of a 4 hour ride. I don't say anything but I wonder why the hell passing me was so important. Weird impulses.

This.

I'm out doing my thing and my give-a-dam meter is on zero when it comes to what others are doing. Whether I pass you or you pass me, it is entirely irrelevant.

2014-06-18 10:08 AM
in reply to: Eucid

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over a barrier
Subject: RE: Damn Cyclists Up Ahead!
I was up in Wisconsin this weekend with some teammates, nice little 6 man pace line smashing along. I was in the front drilling it trying to catch a couple of girls and then rotated off as soon as we passed them, announcing "My work is done"
2014-06-18 10:58 AM
in reply to: running2far

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Boise, ID
Subject: RE: Damn Cyclists Up Ahead!

 

I have the same issue, if I see a cyclist I want to see if I can catch and pass them. I know it makes no sense, they could be at mile 150 for all I know, just gets my blood flowing a bit. Gotta have some fun every now and then.

My LBS has been hosting once a week TT nights. That satisfies the rabbit chasing urge. Lots of fun to run down the people with a head start on you. 

2014-06-18 2:37 PM
in reply to: Eucid

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Mission Viejo,
Subject: RE: Damn Cyclists Up Ahead!
To answer your question, in one word: discipline! I think that there are quite a number of athlete's out there that don't reach their race potential because of a lack of training discipline. We are all guilty of it, I have done the same many times on the bike. See a rider up ahead, it's a fun game to go after that rabbit, hunt em down and blow by em! But, it the training plan calls for an easy recovery ride, that should be the rule rather than the exception as it now sets you up for a not so good effort if the following day you have a hard training day planned. Your easy days need to be easy so you can go hard on the hard days. Also hard to achieve when riding outdoors, others don't know what your prescription for the ride is and you don't want them to think your a pansy because you're taking it nice and slow!


2014-06-18 2:53 PM
in reply to: Coach Gil

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Subject: RE: Damn Cyclists Up Ahead!
When I need a zone 2 recovery ride....a sustained zone 3 effort isn't usually an option. If it is, your probably not riding hard enough in the previous workout, so riding zone 3 isn't so bad anyway.

Going too fast on the bike below zone 4 isn't really a bad thing. It's running where it will cause issues.

One quote I remember for bike training is "bike a lot, some if it hard... and a little really really hard".
2014-06-18 2:58 PM
in reply to: Mc Q

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Subject: RE: Damn Cyclists Up Ahead!
Originally posted by Mc Q

Originally posted by Eucid

How do you overcome the urge to go too hard in training or races?

I figured that I am mentally better suited for sprints/olys as I like to chase rabbits. So there is really not a "too hard" per se in a sprint distance.

In the only HIM distance I did, I struggled with not chasing other bikers and having to ride with blinders on. It was way too boring for me to just be going through the emotions holding back the effort because I knew that I would have 13 miles to reflect on that poor choice.

That's the only way I have figured it out, I stay away from the longer stuff.


depends on your fitness. A really strong cyclist ride at nearly 90% for just over 2 hours in a 70.3, build a 4-6 minute gap and then just "hang on" in the run.

Plus you often don't need to "chase" people. They will over bike the first 30 miles and you can catch them in the last 10. You just need to have patience.
2014-06-18 3:09 PM
in reply to: Eucid

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Subject: RE: Damn Cyclists Up Ahead!

I just stick to what I've planned. I don't mind letting others pass me. Usually I'm too tired for the other workouts that week to go too hard anyway. 

2014-06-18 3:15 PM
in reply to: motoguy128

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Subject: RE: Damn Cyclists Up Ahead!
I am in the middle of the IM training grind. I have been going 2 a day for a few months during the week and going long bike Saturday and long run Sunday. When my coach gives me any workout that has the word "easy" in it then I am all over that. My easy pace goal is to go just fast enough not to fall asleep mid stride. I used to have the problem of going too hard on recovery days but now I realize that if today is a recovery day then tomorrow is going to be a sufferfest. I'm going to enjoy the easy day now because tomorrow will suck enough as it is and I don't care who passes me!
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