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How do you deal with people and dogs on the path?
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 2015-02-04 9:49 PM |
 3 |  Subject: How do you deal with people and dogs on the path?I love riding my tri bike. I'm an experienced mountain biker and enjoy road cycling, so after buying my tri bike in October, I found the transition relatively smooth. Because I’m still gaining confidence, I’ve been riding on a nice 8-10 foot wide 15-mile rails-to-trails path to avoid cars. However, lately I’m miserable. The first time I crashed my bike, I did so because I was not properly balanced. After fixing the seat angle (I didn’t realize it was tilted) and making the appropriate adjustments, I crashed again. It was about a week ago and was caused by a rogue dog that ran downhill and tried biting my front tire. I had 2 choices: hit the dog and endo or veer off the path. I chose the latter. Luckily, after I crashed the dog didn't attack, which would have been pretty ugly because I landed on my back still attached to the bike. After this incident, I purchased a can of HALT spray to protect myself from something like this happening again. I now have huge bruises on my quads making it a little harder to ride but I’ve gone out a couple of times since. I always slow way down and tell people from behind that I’m passing. If they have dogs they usually move them off the trail -if off leash. But, today this guy didn’t move over much and kept his dog on a long lead. I passed him (both of us going in the same direction) and he did nothing, so I assumed his dog was not interested in bikes. Everything was fine when I passed; I’m guessing it’s because the dog didn’t know I was there until I was far enough away. On the return trip, both him and the dog saw me, since we were going in opposite directions. I waved at the man, who neither waved nor tighten up on the leash. Just as I was passing the dog, it charged me. Luckily the man was able to hold the leash but it could have been pretty ugly because the dog almost jumped in front of the bike. I should have stopped and yelled at the guy, but I just got out of there. Then about 10 minutes after this, a squirrel ran out in front of me. I barely cleared it until it ran back, which caused me to run it over. I was so upset. I’m struggling because I LOVE dogs and animals but I really don’t know how to handle this bike when the brakes are so hard to get to, especially when something happens so quickly. I usually don’t pass in the aero position when I’m coming from behind someone, but now I think I’ll stay out of the aero position when passing anyone with a dog. I know there’s not much I could do about the squirrel, but how do you deal with dogs? People? Edited by murphdog 2015-02-04 9:51 PM |
| 2015-02-04 11:17 PM in reply to: #5090681 |
Member 256   Iowa City, Iowa | Subject: RE: How do you deal with people and dogs on the path? I'm an animal lover as well so sorry to hear about the accident. My trail is along the Mississippi and on a good portion of it, there are rocks leading down to the river. As a result of this, anytime I am approaching someone with or without a dog I announce, leave the aero position and slow down. However some people are a little more "owning" of the trails so not much I can think of other than giving them a mean look ?? |
| 2015-02-05 2:14 AM in reply to: ChemNerd23 |
Extreme Veteran 1332 | Subject: RE: How do you deal with people and dogs on the path? Yep, I never pass traffic or pedestrians with dogs or just pedestrians who are close in aero, too much can go wrong. I pretty well use aero riding for the highways etc. or flagged courses and racing etc. |
| 2015-02-05 6:15 AM in reply to: murphdog |
Elite 4344 | Subject: RE: How do you deal with people and dogs on the path? II personally don't think a multi-use trail should be used for fast training on a bicycle unless it is totally unused by walkers.kl The speed difference is too great and distance between bikes and walkers is to close to be safe. I use the road, even in downtown Atlanta. I sometimes ride the Eastside Trail in Atlanta a few miles to get to a road with a bike lane. This is a very heavily used multi-use trail. It has bars and restaurants along it. It has art (of a sort) installations that seem to change frequently. It also has dogs, kids on tricycles, and lots of walkers, When I do ride on that trail, I ride pretty slow, 5-10 mph maybe, and slow down whenever the trail gets crowded at all. I just creep around any of the slower traffic. You may find a rails to trails that is wide enough and with low enough usage to ride for training. Around here, it doesn't exist. Multi-use trails get a lot of use and I am glad. I can ride the roads for training. TW
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| 2015-02-05 7:14 AM in reply to: tech_geezer |
Master 8247 Eugene, Oregon Bronze member | Subject: RE: How do you deal with people and dogs on the path? Like the above poster, I only ride in aero on a rails to trail path (and on the trainer, of course) which is quite lightly used and located in a rural area. (This would be at home in Oregon.) In Vietnam, only on a certain stretch of an industrial park (which is closed to outside vehicle traffic) where I do some of my longer training rides. Even in those situations, I would ALWAYS come out of aero for small children and animals, who move erratically and probably won't heed a verbal warning, any Vietnamese pedestrians (who probably won't understand a verbal warning either in English or my sorry excuse for Vietnamese), and any other potential hazards. Even so, I've had occasional problems on the bike trail with dog-walkers who either refuse to follow the leash law (which is posted everywhere) or walk on one side of the trail with the dog on a very long leash (sometimes not visible from a distance as some stretches thru the woods are very shady) on the other side. In every case where I've had to take evasive action from a dog and politely mentioned the leash policy or asked people to keep dogs on the proper side of the trail, (particularly important since not only bikers, including some pro triathletes, but also horse riders use the trail!) I have gotten responses ranging from total indifference to outright hostility. Not sure what the problem is--not as if I'm riding in a dog park! Have pretty much given up and just slow to a near stop and unclip whenever I see dogs, on or off leash. Same applies to small children and any people who look impaired/unfocused/plugged into electronics. |
| 2015-02-05 9:08 AM in reply to: murphdog |
Extreme Veteran 856 Detroit, Michigan | Subject: RE: How do you deal with people and dogs on the path? I agree with the poster who said that a multi-use path might not be the best place to seriously train on your bike. There are just too many variables -- four-abreast walkers, kids, dogs, etc. Maybe you could use it without too many problems early in the morning before it gets busy. Where I live, there is a nice stretch of road that closes to traffic every Saturday in the summer and it it pretty popular with cyclists. However, it is also popular with the four-abreast walkers, kids, dogs, etc. I mentioned. After some idiot on a bike (without a helmet) swerved in front of me and I almost hit him, I pretty much swore off coming back. I also think you just ran into a couple of bad owners. It sounds like most of the people you come across move out of the way, which is good. Maybe if you see another dog on a loose leash try "Biker back," then if that doesn't work "Biker back, please pull in your dog," etc. I have big dogs who think chasing runners and cyclists is a game, so I always pull them close when someone passes us. I appreciate when someone behind me gives me advance warning (which it sounds like you are doing). As far as the squirrel thing goes, I have also almost hit a squirrel and it is terrifying! The last time it happened to me I screamed an expletive very loudly, lol. I'm sorry that happened to you after the dog incident but sadly there is not much you can do about it except try to avoid them. |
| 2015-02-05 9:40 AM in reply to: ChemNerd23 |
| 1300 | Subject: RE: How do you deal with people and dogs on the path? Can you get there early in the morning? I use a MUP occasionally and after about 9-10 in the AM it can get very crowded. Like others have said I get out of aero anytime passing because I just can't be sure what the other people are doing. I've had some bad experiences like you mentioned. I have found if I get there pretty early it's mostly people training, not nearly as crowded and way less problems. |
| 2015-02-05 2:26 PM in reply to: Goggles Pizzano |
| 3 | Subject: RE: How do you deal with people and dogs on the path? Thanks for the feedback everyone. I think if I do continue to use the trail it'll be in the early am (as suggested) or when the weather is bad. Since I live in Oregon, there’s ample opportunity to ride in the rain, which keeps most people inside. It’s not really a crowded trail but I was under the assumption that this path would be a great alternative to the road while gaining confidence and stability on my bike, but it’s probably time to hit the road. I do like the suggestion to say “biker back” because I usually say “on your left” and people don’t know which side to move to regardless of how far back I am. As for the squirrel, I hope that never happens again. It was so upsetting. Ugh. |
| 2015-02-05 2:30 PM in reply to: Hot Runner |
| 3 | Subject: RE: How do you deal with people and dogs on the path? I think you're right, unclipping is a great suggestion. Are you still in Oregon? The trail I ride is the Row River Trail in Cottage Grove. Beautiful and not too crowded in the winter. The dog that caused me to crash didn't have a collar or owner nearby and was on me in a split second, but I'll unclip and come out of aero when I come upon a dog under normal circumstances. |
| 2015-02-05 2:40 PM in reply to: murphdog |
Pro 15655 | Subject: RE: How do you deal with people and dogs on the path? Ignore the people, pet the dogs.....you can't go wrong.
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| 2015-02-05 2:42 PM in reply to: murphdog |
| Master 10208 Northern IL | Subject: RE: How do you deal with people and dogs on the path? Definitely come out of aero, but what all do you mean by "unclip" for these situations? That's something which can sound nice, but may create more problems. |
| 2015-02-05 3:17 PM in reply to: murphdog |
| Subject: RE: How do you deal with people and dogs on the path? I commute daily with almost have the miles on a MUP. I don't use the commute for structured training. If the path is clear and open, sometimes I'll ride upper Z2 on this stretch, but as far as dealing with people and dogs, I just slow down appropriately so I can make a safe pass. I rarely call anything out unless absolutely necessary. Most times if there might be a dicey situation...I just slow down more. There have been times where I come to a complete stop and put my foot down. As the person passing, it is up to me to do so safely. People are not required to get out of my way simply because I want to train on the path and yell something out. If you can't get a good training workout because your MUP is too crowded, it's probably best not to train on a MUP. Generally if I want to do a training ride within my commute, I'll use the path as a warm up or cool down and detour somewhere else to get my harder efforts in. |
| 2015-02-05 4:20 PM in reply to: murphdog |
Pro 5892 , New Hampshire | Subject: RE: How do you deal with people and dogs on the path? The law varies between city to city, but for the most time there's some kind of speed limit on the MUP's… it may be posted, or it may not… and it may simply be stated as "safe operation speed", which usually means less than 10MPH… |
| 2015-02-05 5:08 PM in reply to: ChemNerd23 |
| Subject: RE: How do you deal with people and dogs on the path? |
| 2015-02-05 6:01 PM in reply to: 0 |
Master 8247 Eugene, Oregon Bronze member | Subject: RE: How do you deal with people and dogs on the path? Hmmm....I was referring to the Row River Trail as well! Quite possibly to the same dog! Lucky not to have hit a squirrel and the pedestrians in general are pretty well behaved except for a few who've been hitting the beer, but plenty of off-leash canines. It's much better on weekdays, very early mornings, and if weather isn't that great. (I'm a teacher and mainly ride it when at home in the summer, so I can time my rides to avoid weekends.) As far as MUP go, Row River is probably one of the safest I have seen to ride a tri bike on, except maybe on a busy summer weekend, since it's in a very low-density area. You do need to be careful at the occasional road crossings, since drivers don't expect cyclists. I DO NOT recommend tri bikes or any serious training on the Willamette River path system in Eugene, though. I've pretty much given up anything on that path except leisurely rides with Mom, and carefully riding back (16 mph or less, out of aero) from a road ride out of town. Edited by Hot Runner 2015-02-05 6:19 PM |
| 2015-02-05 8:49 PM in reply to: murphdog |
Veteran 2297 Great White North | Subject: RE: How do you deal with people and dogs on the path? On pavement should equal "on leash". Anything else is asking for conflict and possibly illegal depending on the jurisdiction. I took my son (7) riding on a busy MUP recently. I am taking him on the road (low traffic loop) next time. Way too many clueless people on the paths. |
| 2015-02-05 8:51 PM in reply to: Miles around Midtown |
Veteran 2297 Great White North | Subject: RE: How do you deal with people and dogs on the path? I snapped a spoke when I hit a squirrel... ran right over his tail. Little bugger doubled back right under my wheel. |
| 2015-02-06 5:42 AM in reply to: simpsonbo |
| Subject: RE: How do you deal with people and dogs on the path? Originally posted by simpsonbo On pavement should equal "on leash". Unfortunately around me that means a pocket fisherman type leash where the dog is in the next county from the person walking it and the leash is invisible to a bike rider. |
| 2015-02-07 2:51 PM in reply to: murphdog |
| 1055 | Subject: RE: How do you deal with people and dogs on the path? Honestly, I feel safer on the roads with the cars. MUP's are full of danger but it sounds like you've been quite unlucky. I've had my run-ins on the MUP, but its rare. Just keep at it and try some new routes. |
| 2015-02-07 7:43 PM in reply to: murphdog |
| Expert 1233 | Subject: RE: How do you deal with people and dogs on the path? I run on MUPs and there are two very dangerous situations; 1) the dog on the leash, 2) the cyclist using the MUP. Being bitten, trip by the leash, and jumped on by dogs, I now follow the same protocol. Loudly announce: 'Runner coming up, please move to your right', followed up with "Please Tighten your leash", then 'thank you very much' as I pass by. People are typically startled at first, but they do move and hold on tighter to the leash. The cyclist situation is a bad accident waiting to happen. Several times I was totally taken off guard when all there was a sudden 'on your left' as someone zipped by at a good clip. I always ride on the road, and while I don't like putting restrictions on cyclists, riding on MUPs should only be done at a leisurely pace. |
| 2015-02-08 6:16 AM in reply to: murphdog |
| Subject: RE: How do you deal with people and dogs on the path? Most of the people I see are the same ones and they tighten up the dog and I slow down. I have larger concern with the deer sometimes more then dogs. |
| 2015-02-08 9:49 AM in reply to: #5090681 |
Regular 156 | Subject: RE: How do you deal with people and dogs on the path? Was bitten by a dog while running on a MUP a few years ago. Infuriated me. Your right to walk your dog cannot infringe on my right to enjoy my run without being bitten. Owners were aplogetic but that made the bite no less painful ot potentially harmful. Control your dogs! |
| 2015-02-08 5:07 PM in reply to: murphdog |
| Subject: RE: How do you deal with people and dogs on the path? I'm someone who runs on MUPs with my dog. I don't wear earphones, and I use a leash shorter than the allowed 6' which is securely fastened around my waist. I think I'm attentive, but I still have runners & bikers sneak up on me from time to time. MUPs by their nature mean you will have to compromise...mine is to constantly check behind me because so many other runners & bikers don't announce their pass. If you alert the person you are passing, you are doing the first step correctly. The second step (making the pass) is a little more complicated. The sentiment of LB's post is right on, but his wording is exactly the opposite of what I would advise. Instead of ignoring the person, I think paying attention to the human is the most important thing when approaching a dog & owner. Is the human paying attention? Does the human have a firm grip on the leash with at least one hand? Is the human on a cellphone, or is he/she wearing headphones? Does the human react when you announce your pass...does he/she shorten the leash or move to the side? It's a lot harder to determine if a dog is excited to play or excited to hunt you than it is to determine whether the owner is being responsible. Murphdog, you mentioned in your first post that you read the human & didn't like what you saw (didn't acknowledge you & didn't tighten the leash). Once you identify a potentially bad situation, just don't let yourself get into it. You might have to off-road it for a few feet, slow down, speed up, or even stop. It sucks, but part of the compromise with using MUPs is the fact that not everyone is going to be as accommodating to fellow users as they should be. |
| 2015-02-09 7:41 AM in reply to: Boilermaker |
New user 246 madison, Wisconsin | Subject: RE: How do you deal with people and dogs on the path? I use a MUP all of the time. It's the main artery, and really the only logical way out to my real training area. That said, there are very real dangers and it is our job to make it as safe as possible for everyone involved (the M in MUP). So if I'm riding, I shift way down and spin like crazy. Good warm up and I, like many of us, can benefit from the high cadence workout. When I'm approaching someone, I offer a very loud, yet pleasant, "passing on your left, please". And then a "thank you" as I go by. Politeness goes a long way. My big fear is when I'm out on roller skis. Dogs HATE roller skis. The other night, I was passing a guy that was running with is dog (opposite directions). The leash was around the guy's waist. When I got close the dog darted across the guy's body at me, tripping the guy. But, the bad part of that is that there was also a bike passing the guy at the same time (bad pass) and the bike had to come to a screeching halt to not run over the dog that now had run out in front of him. It was an ugly situation all around. Nobody was hurt and I think all three of us wanted to blame the other folks. But instead I asked if everyone was ok, patted the dog on the head and we all went about our business. In reality, nothing would have been gained by placing blame and yelling. On a related note, last summer I hit a rabbit. It darted out in front of my buddy and paused just enough that I nailed it. I didn't crash but I had to go back and stomp on it's head because it was laying there suffering. That sucked! |
| 2015-02-09 10:19 AM in reply to: tech_geezer |
Regular 589 Wisconsin | Subject: RE: How do you deal with people and dogs on the path? Originally posted by tech_geezer II personally don't think a multi-use trail should be used for fast training on a bicycle unless it is totally unused by walkers.kl The speed difference is too great and distance between bikes and walkers is to close to be safe. I use the road, even in downtown Atlanta. I sometimes ride the Eastside Trail in Atlanta a few miles to get to a road with a bike lane. This is a very heavily used multi-use trail. It has bars and restaurants along it. It has art (of a sort) installations that seem to change frequently. It also has dogs, kids on tricycles, and lots of walkers, When I do ride on that trail, I ride pretty slow, 5-10 mph maybe, and slow down whenever the trail gets crowded at all. I just creep around any of the slower traffic. You may find a rails to trails that is wide enough and with low enough usage to ride for training. Around here, it doesn't exist. Multi-use trails get a lot of use and I am glad. I can ride the roads for training. TW
I agree with this. I actually get out of aero, slow down, unclip one foot when I am passing. |
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