BT Development Mentor Program Archives » Slornow and Wannabefaster's mentor group...Closed Rss Feed  
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2016-10-05 2:23 PM
in reply to: wannabefaster

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Oakville
Subject: RE: Slornow and Wannabefaster's mentor group...Closed

With triathlon season being officially over for me, I had planned on taking a break from racing until 2017.  I have been am feeling restless and will likely sign up for a HM in early November.

5 weeks to race day, but my run training for my mid-September HIM should be a decent base and starting point (30 to 40 kms/week).

I've ran about a half dozen HMs and my usual training is to aim for roughly double the distance for total weekly kms (40 to 45 kms) and long runs building to at least two or three runs of 18 to 19 kms.  I've never ran the full HM distance or longer in training.

I'm going to change things up this time and try to increase total volume to closer to 50 to 55 kms but still cap the long run at 18 to 19 kms.

Typical week would be 4 runs, with 3 shorter runs between 10 and 12 kms and the 1 long run of 18 or 19 kms. 

Not planning any speedwork as I've tried 3 different times to add speed sessions but each time ended up with an injury.

For those that also race HMs, what did your training look like when you ran your PB?



2016-10-06 6:14 PM
in reply to: Scott71

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Subject: RE: Slornow and Wannabefaster's mentor group...Closed
My PR HM was run the day after a 50 mile ride, 5 mile run, brick. My legs felt like crap and I thought I was doomed. But I went out with the faster guys, and while the last 2 miles were pure hell, I hung on for my PR.

At the time I was in the middle of what was my best IM build ever. I was running 40-45 miles per week on top of 3-4 bike sessions and 5-6 swim sessions per week.

I am still not sure what happened on that day but somehow the stars aligned for that PR.
2016-10-07 8:33 AM
in reply to: wannabefaster

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Oakville
Subject: RE: Slornow and Wannabefaster's mentor group...Closed

Ha, taper be damned!!

I've had a few of those races where the results just don't seem to make sense based on training or fatigue.  

A few years ago a Sprint tri was cancelled due to weather but the RD offered a free entry in either a 5K or HM road race the next day.

Despite several bottles of wine the night before, I ran the 5K in a PR.  I think I was mentally prepared to suffer for that race, given I had no business running 5K in the condition I was in.

2016-10-07 3:45 PM
in reply to: Scott71

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Subject: RE: Slornow and Wannabefaster's mentor group...Closed

My HM PR was in my last HIM, but I'm pretty sure I'm one of those very strange people who's better the longer I go....and a better runner if it's off the bike.  I suspect if I were to race an open HM, I could probably beat my HIM run split, but I've proven to really suck at pacing open run races!

I was coming off 30-35 miles a week run training.  I was doing once a week track or hill work (per my coach's plan) and most of my long runs had some tempo work (2x10' to 2x15', so nothing excessive).  I don't know how much those did for my physical ability to hold race pace, but certainly did a ton for me mentally.  

My long run was never at race distance.  I was running 6x a week....anything less than 5x a week and I feel like I "lose the feel" for it (much like swimmers say about swimming).  Can you fit in 5-6 runs a week instead of four?  

2016-10-08 12:51 PM
in reply to: ligersandtions

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Oakville
Subject: RE: Slornow and Wannabefaster's mentor group...Closed

Originally posted by ligersandtions

My long run was never at race distance.  I was running 6x a week....anything less than 5x a week and I feel like I "lose the feel" for it (much like swimmers say about swimming).  Can you fit in 5-6 runs a week instead of four?  

Thanks for the advice Nicole.  I've never ran more than 4x a week, mainly because of injury concerns.  At 4x a week, there are fewer back to back days and I personally start to notice the aches and pains increase considerably when I run on consecutive days.

It could be all in my head, but having dealt with a few running related injuries this year, I'm taking a conservative approach.

There is another HM early next year that I've regularly run in the past, and may try to slowly build in extra days and see how the body responds.  

2016-10-08 1:23 PM
in reply to: Scott71

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Subject: RE: Slornow and Wannabefaster's mentor group...Closed

Originally posted by Scott71

Originally posted by ligersandtions

My long run was never at race distance.  I was running 6x a week....anything less than 5x a week and I feel like I "lose the feel" for it (much like swimmers say about swimming).  Can you fit in 5-6 runs a week instead of four?  

Thanks for the advice Nicole.  I've never ran more than 4x a week, mainly because of injury concerns.  At 4x a week, there are fewer back to back days and I personally start to notice the aches and pains increase considerably when I run on consecutive days.

It could be all in my head, but having dealt with a few running related injuries this year, I'm taking a conservative approach.

There is another HM early next year that I've regularly run in the past, and may try to slowly build in extra days and see how the body responds.  

You may take a look at the BarryP plan and see if it might work for you.  I've found that following something like that, with some short, stupid-easy runs for the extra couple runs works well for me and keeps me uninjured and keeping the feeling of running.  

I'm not sure of your paces, but three runs of 10-12k would put me about an hour each....instead of that, my schedule generally looks like four runs of 30-45 minutes each (very easy, aerobic pace), one 60ish minute run (generally with some tempo, track, or hill intervals -- but would not hesitate to make it all aerobic if any of these things would result in getting me injured), and a 90ish minute long run (sometimes with some tempo work, sometimes all aerobic).



2016-10-09 9:49 PM
in reply to: ligersandtions

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Master
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Subject: RE: Slornow and Wannabefaster's mentor group...Closed
I want to second the BarryP plan as a spectacular, tremendous, wonderful (sorry, watching the debate) way of improving run skill. Three short, easy runs of length 'n'. Two runs of length '2n'. One run of '3n'. Six runs per week.

If you are achy the day after a run then you are probably running too hard. The vast majority of your runs should be easy (anecdotally, I fail at this more often than I would like to admit). Running is the only one of the three disciplines where slow, easy running in training can result in fast paces on race day.

Consistency/volume is way more important than any one workout. At one point I had a several year streak going where I ran at least 100 miles every month. That set me up with a running base that has stuck with me ever since.

Run a lot, at a very easy pace and you will get faster. And yes, stay healthy. Hard to train while injured.
2016-10-11 9:58 AM
in reply to: wannabefaster

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Master
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ann arbor, michigan
Subject: RE: Slornow and Wannabefaster's mentor group...Closed
We had talked about run pace in the past and I am pretty sure that I had commented that there is always someone faster....

A guy I have met a couple times at races and follow on twitter ran the Chicago marathon this weekend..... in 2:26:44. That means that every single 5K split he ran in a marathon is faster than my fastest stand alone 5K ever.

Time to get to work :-)
2016-10-11 2:59 PM
in reply to: ligersandtions

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Oakville
Subject: RE: Slornow and Wannabefaster's mentor group...Closed

I have another HM on my calendar for next March and will take a look at Barry P's plan.

I seem to have my PF sorted out and the only other injury issue is my right hip.  It starts to flare up when I run longer distances - usually at round 18 or 19 kms but has been as early as the 14 km mark.  My physio diagnosed it as tendinopathy and gave me some exercises and recommended simply running more. 

I was expecting it to be an issue for my HIM but thankfully it was manageable.

I'm hoping to "toughen up" the tendon with higher weekly volume and with longer "short" runs.

2016-10-13 1:45 PM
in reply to: wannabefaster

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Elite
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Subject: RE: Slornow and Wannabefaster's mentor group...Closed

I'm trying to follow a modified BarryP plan at the moment - modified because the middle and longer runs are shorter than intended (or you could say my short runs are too long...), but I took the approach that I want to build the consistency before I worry about the true volume.  Hit a couple of missed days, but otherwise was tracking close to 100 miles without running more than 7 miles in a single run in September.

I'm also taking the same approach with swimming at the moment - trying to get in the pool 5 days a week, even though most of them are onyl for about 30min, but just trying to gain the consistency (my bike has been barely touched in weeks).  Question for the group - what is the best thing you've done that has resulted in improved swim times (apart from a coach and more swimming)?

2016-10-14 7:37 PM
in reply to: GoFaster

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Ottawa, Ontario
Subject: RE: Slornow and Wannabefaster's mentor group...Closed
This isn't telling you something you don't already know, but I found that frequency gave me the biggest gains in swim time. Specifically when I went from 2x/week to 3x/week, it didn't take long to notice a significant drop in times. Obviously volume plays in a role here, but I think the fact that I never took more than two days off in a row helped too as I kept a good feel for the water.


2016-10-17 10:34 AM
in reply to: SenatorClayDavis

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Master
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ann arbor, michigan
Subject: RE: Slornow and Wannabefaster's mentor group...Closed
Ran the Detroit Marathon yesterday and while there were some hard moments in there I never once thought about quitting the race :-)

Went 3:05:29; 1:32:29 first half, 1:33 second half. I started at 7:00 pace and that was what my legs had in them. I am going to stop setting time goals and just do the training and let the results be what they will be. I am actually very happy with how I raced. It would have been easy to slow down when the going got tough but I felt like I needed a little redemption.

I have been guilty of not taking much time off at the end of the season in the past. I am going to not run for a whole week. Just a little swimming and some lounging around. There will be plenty of time to get my run groove going over the next six months or so.

2016-10-17 12:58 PM
in reply to: GoFaster

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Houston, Texas
Subject: RE: Slornow and Wannabefaster's mentor group...Closed

Originally posted by GoFaster

I'm trying to follow a modified BarryP plan at the moment - modified because the middle and longer runs are shorter than intended (or you could say my short runs are too long...), but I took the approach that I want to build the consistency before I worry about the true volume.  Hit a couple of missed days, but otherwise was tracking close to 100 miles without running more than 7 miles in a single run in September.

I'm also taking the same approach with swimming at the moment - trying to get in the pool 5 days a week, even though most of them are onyl for about 30min, but just trying to gain the consistency (my bike has been barely touched in weeks).  Question for the group - what is the best thing you've done that has resulted in improved swim times (apart from a coach and more swimming)?

Whatever you do, don't follow my swim training plan!  A few years ago, I was a 32-34 minute HIM swimmer....and in the past year or so, I've been more like a 38-39 minute HIM swimmer.  Leading into Santa Cruz, I decided I'd shoot for some additional volume (12k/week, which isn't huge, but more than the 10k I'd previously been doing) and see if I could bring my time back down closer to 34-35 minutes.  Swam yet another 38 minutes and have no idea why I've gotten worse (both in the pool and in races....used to be top 15% coming out of the water and now lucky to be in the top 50%).

After Austin 70.3, I'm going to quit swimming....at least for a month.  The last time I quit swimming for a month was probably the start of this downward slide, but I am sick of the early mornings that result in backward progress, so I need to do this for my (mental) sake!

On a positive note, my bike and run are greatly improved....so there's a good possibility that my swim now sucks because I'm carrying more fatigue from biking and running.  Certainly not that I've lost buoyancy (that does not seem to be an issue!)

2016-10-18 7:36 PM
in reply to: ligersandtions

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Master
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Subject: RE: Slornow and Wannabefaster's mentor group...Closed
I'm with you on the early morning thing. I have been forcing myself to get out of bed for longer than I care to think about in order to get my swimming in. I am done with 4:30 wake ups for awhile. Just too much overall fatigue.

No matter how hard I try to convince myself, I am NOT a morning person :-)
2016-10-19 3:21 PM
in reply to: wannabefaster

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Master
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South Alabama
Subject: RE: Slornow and Wannabefaster's mentor group...Closed

Originally posted by wannabefaster Ran the Detroit Marathon yesterday and while there were some hard moments in there I never once thought about quitting the race :-) Went 3:05:29; 1:32:29 first half, 1:33 second half. I started at 7:00 pace and that was what my legs had in them. I am going to stop setting time goals and just do the training and let the results be what they will be. I am actually very happy with how I raced. It would have been easy to slow down when the going got tough but I felt like I needed a little redemption. I have been guilty of not taking much time off at the end of the season in the past. I am going to not run for a whole week. Just a little swimming and some lounging around. There will be plenty of time to get my run groove going over the next six months or so.

 

That's a great time.  Well done Jason.

2016-10-26 12:14 PM
in reply to: slornow

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Subject: RE: Slornow and Wannabefaster's mentor group...Closed

Last race of the season coming up this weekend (well, last triathlon race....I imagine I'll probably do some short running races, like a Turkey Trot)!  I'm racing Austin 70.3 with the plan to push the bike a bit.  I normally shoot for a little shy of 80% and find myself way under-shooting my bike target because I convince myself that it hurts too much and I won't be able to run after.  Plan for this race is to shoot for a little over 80% and ignore RPE altogether....and see what happens on the run.  The race wasn't initially on my schedule, it's within driving distance, and it's a race that basically everyone hates, so I figured it's a perfect opportunity to be willing to blow up!

Following that, I have almost a week in Moab, UT, where I'm considering trying mountain biking for the first time.  I'm a little intimidated, tbh, and really have no clue what I'm doing, so we'll see!  Any tips or recommendations are welcome if anyone in here is a MTB'er



2016-10-27 8:38 PM
in reply to: ligersandtions

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Master
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Subject: RE: Slornow and Wannabefaster's mentor group...Closed
Good luck this weekend. Sounds like a great way to end the season; testing your limits while racing. You may just surprise yourself.

A friend of mine just got back from Moab. He said that the mountain biking there was amazing. There might be someone out there that will give you some intro to mountain biking lessons and take you out on the trails. It would probably be an excellent way to get started.
2016-11-03 11:26 PM
in reply to: wannabefaster

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Subject: RE: Slornow and Wannabefaster's mentor group...Closed

In Moab now....it's really beautiful!  Hoping to try the mountain bike thing on Sunday

I was finally able to finish writing my Austin 70.3 (69.1) race report: http://beginnertriathlete.com/discussion/forums/thread-view.asp?tid=544349&posts=1#M5203965 

2016-11-17 2:11 PM
in reply to: wannabefaster

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Subject: RE: Slornow and Wannabefaster's mentor group...Closed

Originally posted by wannabefaster I'm with you on the early morning thing. I have been forcing myself to get out of bed for longer than I care to think about in order to get my swimming in. I am done with 4:30 wake ups for awhile. Just too much overall fatigue. No matter how hard I try to convince myself, I am NOT a morning person :-)

I was lucky for awhile, I had a masters group I could join at noon.  But then my job moved offices farther from the pool .  Fortunately we're getting back over to the old location in January.

I hate hate hate hate hate doing anything productive in the morning.

2016-11-18 8:49 AM
in reply to: spudone

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Subject: RE: Slornow and Wannabefaster's mentor group...Closed

Originally posted by spudone

Originally posted by wannabefaster I'm with you on the early morning thing. I have been forcing myself to get out of bed for longer than I care to think about in order to get my swimming in. I am done with 4:30 wake ups for awhile. Just too much overall fatigue. No matter how hard I try to convince myself, I am NOT a morning person :-)

I was lucky for awhile, I had a masters group I could join at noon.  But then my job moved offices farther from the pool .  Fortunately we're getting back over to the old location in January.

I hate hate hate hate hate doing anything productive in the morning.

I actually enjoy my morning training....much more than nights (which I will also do, but sometimes struggle with timing to allow for good eating / digesting / winding down / going to bed schedule), and I really have no idea how people do midday training.  I don't have time (work schedule is not very flexible) and don't want to come back stinky and sweaty!

My issue with morning swimming is that swimming and I currently have a hate-hate relationship, and I don't want to get up at 4:30am to go do something I'm getting worse at!  Currently running and doing a bit of strength training in place of my previous swim-torture training

2016-11-18 9:18 AM
in reply to: ligersandtions

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Subject: RE: Slornow and Wannabefaster's mentor group...Closed

Funny how different everyone can be.  I love to swim and bike early before work but not running.  The majority of my running is at lunch during the week and on weekends if I don't get it in by about 1pm it's probably not happening!  The only thing that I will do after work is ride my bike - not a workout, just go for a ride.



2016-11-18 11:46 AM
in reply to: axteraa

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Subject: RE: Slornow and Wannabefaster's mentor group...Closed

I will run in the morning this time of year if I have to, just because that's when it is light out and it's safer.  But in the summer I much prefer an evening bike / run.

2016-11-18 12:02 PM
in reply to: spudone

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Subject: RE: Slornow and Wannabefaster's mentor group...Closed

Originally posted by spudone

I will run in the morning this time of year if I have to, just because that's when it is light out and it's safer.  But in the summer I much prefer an evening bike / run.

It's light in WA in the morning?  I thought it was dark until like 8am!  I swear, when I lived up there (which was for the first 22 years of my life) it was dark at 4pm and didn't get light again until 8am!  Summers are awesome, but winters were brutal....I'd struggle with that these days (hell, I'm whiney about the lack of daylight hours in the winter in Houston!). 

2016-11-20 10:24 PM
in reply to: axteraa

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Ottawa, Ontario
Subject: RE: Slornow and Wannabefaster's mentor group...Closed
I do 95% of my training after the kids are in bed. I've made a few attempts at early morning training but it just wasn't feasible. My closest pool has lane swim at 8:30pm and that's around the the same time I get on the bike/treadmill. In the summer I get outside for my longer weekend ride, but otherwise I'm an after dark dude.
2016-11-20 10:30 PM
in reply to: SenatorClayDavis

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Subject: RE: Slornow and Wannabefaster's mentor group...Closed
Hey gang,

Anyone see what Lionel did at IMAZ today ? IM world record.

I saw him Thursday at a function and he said he was feeling great, I guess that was an understatement
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