General Discussion Triathlon Talk » Explain to me how you HTFU on the run? Rss Feed  
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2008-09-17 12:11 PM

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Subject: Explain to me how you HTFU on the run?
I know it is mental, but how do you get past "mind-blocks" for running? How do you relax while running versus biking or swimming? For me while biking it's easy to get through "pain points" by slowing cadence or dropping a gear; for swimming, I just glide a little more and stay happy I'm in the water (it is my happy place), but dropping the cadence or slowing down more than the slow pace I am already running actually works against me. I gotta bust this plateau. Any suggestions would be helpful.


2008-09-17 12:17 PM
in reply to: #1679893

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Subject: RE: Explain to me how you HTFU on the run?

More interval training.   Repeats.   But that's just me. 

 

2008-09-17 12:30 PM
in reply to: #1679893

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Subject: RE: Explain to me how you HTFU on the run?

Mind blocks how?  Are you talking about strenuous efforts like a 5k or something?  Or are you just talking about the tedious day to day runs?

The only way to decrease the "pain" level of a run is to slow it down and get your HR back under control.

Being able to hold a pace that is not comfortable over the length of the effort?  That is what makes the difference between the athlete that can achieve their potential and those that can't.  Interval sessions are good for that, but they should also only last 5 minutes per interval at the most (with equal time to recover).

Tempo runs from 20 - 45 minutes allow you to knock on that LT door without overdoing it and are good for the HTFU mental aspect.



Edited by Daremo 2008-09-17 12:31 PM
2008-09-17 12:33 PM
in reply to: #1679893


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Subject: RE: Explain to me how you HTFU on the run?

Here are a few suggestions:

Mix some slow and fast together.  Do sets of 30 seconds fast (not sprinting, but pick up the pace a little) and then 30 seconds normal pace.  I do this on days when I can't seem to get in a groove.  It helps pass the time.

Run with an ipod.  (Just be careful to stay alert when running outside)

Find someone or a group to run with.  Even better if you can find someone who is just slightly faster than you.  Even if you dont' run with someone, have a training parter that will ask about your run and hold you accountable.

Mostly just run outside and not on a treadmill if possible.  I find it much easier to get in my running zone outside.  And its harder to quit.  You gotta get back home somehow, so might as well run it, right?

 

2008-09-17 12:34 PM
in reply to: #1679893

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Subject: RE: Explain to me how you HTFU on the run?
Get off the road!  No, seriously.  Good trails are way more fun to run.  Music.  Rain and mud puddles!  And the nice part about good trails is that they usually involve hills, which make the flats so much easier.
2008-09-17 12:52 PM
in reply to: #1679941

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Subject: RE: Explain to me how you HTFU on the run?
NC Runner - 2008-09-17 1:33 PM

Here are a few suggestions:

Mix some slow and fast together.  Do sets of 30 seconds fast (not sprinting, but pick up the pace a little) and then 30 seconds normal pace.  I do this on days when I can't seem to get in a groove.  It helps pass the time.

Run with an ipod.  (Just be careful to stay alert when running outside)

Find someone or a group to run with.  Even better if you can find someone who is just slightly faster than you.  Even if you dont' run with someone, have a training parter that will ask about your run and hold you accountable.

Mostly just run outside and not on a treadmill if possible.  I find it much easier to get in my running zone outside.  And its harder to quit.  You gotta get back home somehow, so might as well run it, right?

 

Good suggestions (all of you). I guess I'm a bit of an odd duck though, where I find it 10x easier to get into a running zone on a treadmill than the road. Treadmills, for the most part, force me to keep a pace, whereas on the road my pace is constantly changing. Excelelnt point about having to get back home though...that's one reason my bike routes are loops. Of course the other odd thing for me is I find running a brick twice as easy as running a stand-alone training run.


2008-09-17 12:59 PM
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Subject: RE: Explain to me how you HTFU on the run?

Learn to separate from pace.  If it hurts, slow down.  Who cares if you run your training run 30 seconds faster today, or 30 seconds slower?

2008-09-17 3:14 PM
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Subject: RE: Explain to me how you HTFU on the run?
You can learn to HTFU on the run by forcing yourself to run for a period of time outside your comfort zone. That could mean taking a short run and pushing a faster pace or taking a run and going a much longer distance at your regular pace. However, from your logs you really aren't doing enough running to even consider having to HTFU on a run.
2008-09-17 3:23 PM
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Subject: RE: Explain to me how you HTFU on the run?

I think you need to accept that discomfort pain is going to be part of the process if you want to get faster, but I am not sure that is what you are asking since you talk about slowing down on the bike or gliding along happy when swimming as a way to get through it.  That says you slow down to get by, right?

If you are bored, change your venue (run on a trail) or slap on some earphones and listen to music.  I find both let me run for a very long time. 

Otherwise I agree with Daremo, tempo runs are a great way to get you faster while experiencing discomfort for a short period of time.  It is all part of the process.

 

2008-09-17 3:25 PM
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Subject: RE: Explain to me how you HTFU on the run?

Donskiman - 2008-09-17 4:14 PM You can learn to HTFU on the run by forcing yourself to run for a period of time outside your comfort zone. That could mean taking a short run and pushing a faster pace or taking a run and going a much longer distance at your regular pace. However, from your logs you really aren't doing enough running to even consider having to HTFU on a run.

The farthest I ran in the 15 years prior to May was from the couch to the fridge and back during football game commercial breaks, so relatively speaking, my running is of considerable frequency/distance to me.   

2008-09-17 3:47 PM
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Subject: RE: Explain to me how you HTFU on the run?

Lots of good advice for run training in the previous posts. 

I would add that incorporating some road races into your running schedule will toughen you mentally.  There is just something about mentally pushing yourself through discomfort in a 5K or 10K race that is hard to duplicate in a training run.  



2008-09-17 3:50 PM
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Subject: RE: Explain to me how you HTFU on the run?

Well, from looking at your logs, it looks like all your runs are pretty close to the same pace- always between 9:00- 9:30ish min/mile.  You should probably try to vary your pace more and slow it down and incorporate some EZ runs into your schedule- and run those like at least 30 secs slower than what you're running now.  You should notice a huge difference in how you feel- it should feel super easy.  By doing EZ runs, when you're ready to push it on a tempo run or intervals or what not, you're able to do so and it shouldn't be as painful.  I personally LOVE tempo runs- I can get into a groove, it feels good, and yet I still feel like I'm pushing myself and working at it.

 



Edited by runnergirl 2008-09-17 3:51 PM
2008-09-17 4:03 PM
in reply to: #1680641

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Subject: RE: Explain to me how you HTFU on the run?

I struggle most mentally on runs.  I used to be a total distaster at the end of a tri, but have improved a lot.  I really enjoy straight running races, which you might try for a change of focus (esp middle distance like 10 or 15k) Some things I have done are:

  1. Remind myself during training runs that the distance or pace I achieve is not going to impress anyone so I need to be kinder to myself.  Some times I have bad days, no biggie.   Going the distance is most important.
  2. If I am at the end of a run and slogging through, pace is down and I'm tired from a hill perhaps, I actually speed up a bit.  This helps because it makes me more confident (hey, I CAN do this) and seperates mental from physical.  Feeling fast and feeling a little breeze helps me remember why running is fun.
  3. If it's really rough, I allow myself to walk a minute.  I feel refreshed when i start again, it's like a restart. 
  4. If it's just kind of rough, I slow down to get my HR back under control.  It's not all or nothing.
  5. Change my routes.  I love running outside, but you can also change your "route" on the treadmill by changing speed or incline. Or use an iTrain program. 

I think that number 5 is the most beneficial. And if you mean how to HTFU in a race, I'm still working on that one.  Imagining being done helps a lot  

2008-09-17 4:24 PM
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Subject: RE: Explain to me how you HTFU on the run?
kagoscuba - 2008-09-17 2:25 PM

Donskiman - 2008-09-17 4:14 PM You can learn to HTFU on the run by forcing yourself to run for a period of time outside your comfort zone. That could mean taking a short run and pushing a faster pace or taking a run and going a much longer distance at your regular pace. However, from your logs you really aren't doing enough running to even consider having to HTFU on a run.

The farthest I ran in the 15 years prior to May was from the couch to the fridge and back during football game commercial breaks, so relatively speaking, my running is of considerable frequency/distance to me.   

Sorry! I didn't mean to put down your efforts. It's just that many people want to run like experienced runners without having done what's necessary to acquire the experience. IMO, you shouldn't even be worrying about things like this until you have a solid year of a minimum of 25-30 miles/week. It's great that you are pursuing a more active lifestyle, but try not to put the cart before the horse.

I got this same dose of reality when I started a few years ago. I recall thinking that running 10-15 miles/week was huge and when I asked why I wasn't improving I was told I needed to run about 30 miles/week. It took some time to get there but eventually I did, and I did improve.

Your main goal at this point should be to just build a solid base. All that HTFU, speedwork, tempo stuff will come into play after you build that base.

2008-09-18 1:53 AM
in reply to: #1680688

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Subject: RE: Explain to me how you HTFU on the run?
BikerGrrrl - 2008-09-17 5:03 PM

If I am at the end of a run and slogging through, pace is down and I'm tired from a hill perhaps, I actually speed up a bit.  This helps because it makes me more confident (hey, I CAN do this) and seperates mental from physical.  Feeling fast and feeling a little breeze helps me remember why running is fun.

x2.

I'm also one who prefers to run on a good treadmill - MUCH easier to get into the zone! I never have to worry about accidentally slowing down while my mind wanders. Then again, I have come to appreciate the mental focus that road running entails, and see that as part of the training. I NEVER run with music, except at the gym.

I respectfully disagree with donskiman: I think right now is exactly when a lot of new runners have to HTFU. Much more so (it seems) than regular runners. The "yeah! I'm gonna do it!" excitement and newness has worn off. The changes have stopped coming as fast. Everyone's stopped asking how you are doing. The initial rush is gone. But, you aren't yet where you want to be. You aren't fast enough. You can't run far enough. It is a struggle to go up that 10%...or 7%...each week. You are desperate to just be there already. This is the time when diets fail. When the equipment goes into the corner and blends in with the plants. The gym membership gets renewed for just one more month. This is the time when you have to dig the deepest. It isn't a habit yet. It isn't ingrained yet. It isn't an absolutely accepted part of your day, week, life yet. It is really freaking hard to just keep going.

But that is what you do. You just keep going. You ignore people who say you won't get better until you are running x mpw. You ignore people who say you should run at x pace. You ignore people who say you should do x program, or no program at all. Mostly, though, you ignore the voice in your head that says, "Are we done now? Are we there yet?" The answer is no, and the answer is to HTFU.

Just. do. it. Keep putting one foot in front of the other. Change scenery, look around more, get a good long daydream going that you look forward to continuing each day. Find a Really Scary Hill, drive to the bottom of it, and start running. Run as far as you can, then mark your spot where you start walking. Next week, come back to the hill and run it again. And again. Until you crush that sucker. Then find a new challenge. Keep finding new challenges, in the form of races, or hills, or routes, or times of day.

That is how to HTFU. Good luck.

Edited by Slugger 2008-09-18 1:53 AM
2008-09-18 9:19 AM
in reply to: #1679893

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Subject: RE: Explain to me how you HTFU on the run?
I use mantras. My favorite one right now is "Your body is strong, your mind is weak". Because to HTFU on the run you have to be mentally strong. Your mind doubts the ability of the body and you can't let your mind take control and let you slow down because your body is strong. Or I tell myself over and over that I AM strong, I WILL do this, I CAN do this.

I have a hard time on the runs.


2008-09-18 9:40 AM
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Subject: RE: Explain to me how you HTFU on the run?
Awesome post, Slugger!
2008-09-18 9:48 AM
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Subject: RE: Explain to me how you HTFU on the run?
I've been having problems with this.  Yesterday, I switched my route and ran with an iPod and felt a lot better.  I get really bored with the same route over and over.
2008-09-18 10:10 AM
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Subject: RE: Explain to me how you HTFU on the run?

Dealing with your mind in situations like this is like dealing with a child that is throwing a tantrum.  If you choose to fight, you CANNOT lose.  Iff you lose, you will always lose.  If you win, you can win everytime.  So, if you decide you need to HTFU on the run, and your mind starts to question your body, you cannot let it win.  You have to win.  You have to grit your teeth, and keep going.  Your mind will subside and you will feel good again.  All of the sudden, it will come roaring back with a stronger case, more reasons to quit.  You still can't lose the battle. 

 

 

2008-09-18 12:09 PM
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Subject: RE: Explain to me how you HTFU on the run?

BHannahs - 2008-09-18 10:40 AM Awesome post, Slugger!

 

Ditto!

2008-09-18 3:53 PM
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Subject: RE: Explain to me how you HTFU on the run?

Slugger - 2008-09-18 12:53 AM I respectfully disagree with donskiman: I think right now is exactly when a lot of new runners have to HTFU. Much more so (it seems) than regular runners. The "yeah! I'm gonna do it!" excitement and newness has worn off. The changes have stopped coming as fast. Everyone's stopped asking how you are doing. The initial rush is gone. But, you aren't yet where you want to be. You aren't fast enough. You can't run far enough. It is a struggle to go up that 10%...or 7%...each week. You are desperate to just be there already. This is the time when diets fail. When the equipment goes into the corner and blends in with the plants. The gym membership gets renewed for just one more month. This is the time when you have to dig the deepest. It isn't a habit yet. It isn't ingrained yet. It isn't an absolutely accepted part of your day, week, life yet. It is really freaking hard to just keep going. But that is what you do. You just keep going. You ignore people who say you won't get better until you are running x mpw. You ignore people who say you should run at x pace. You ignore people who say you should do x program, or no program at all. Mostly, though, you ignore the voice in your head that says, "Are we done now? Are we there yet?" The answer is no, and the answer is to HTFU. Just. do. it. Keep putting one foot in front of the other. Change scenery, look around more, get a good long daydream going that you look forward to continuing each day. Find a Really Scary Hill, drive to the bottom of it, and start running. Run as far as you can, then mark your spot where you start walking. Next week, come back to the hill and run it again. And again. Until you crush that sucker. Then find a new challenge. Keep finding new challenges, in the form of races, or hills, or routes, or times of day. That is how to HTFU. Good luck.

The thing we disagree on is when to HTFU. I took the question to be how to HTFU "while" running. Your response points at how to HTFU in order to get out to run. Obviously if HTFU isn't applied as you describe then HTFU while actually running is moot. Learning how to HTFU while running can only come as a result of learning to HTFU to just do it.

The hardest thing for some people is just taking the first step of a run. Many excuses are used to not take that step. It's too hot, too cold, too windy, etc., the list is almost endless. Heck, I've probably used them all at one time or another in my years of running. Now I just go. I ignore all the excuses. There have been plenty of runs where I'd much rather be doing something else, but I can't get to where I want to go if I don't do the necessary work to get there.

 



2008-09-18 4:04 PM
in reply to: #1679893

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Subject: RE: Explain to me how you HTFU on the run?
I am going to agree with get off the treadmill. I think they give people a false sense of running fitness. I think they have their place when the weather is bad or it is not safe to run outside for other reasons(traffic, crime ect.) but I know lots of people who run exclusively on a treadmill and have a tough time when they hit the road. When I run on a treadmill I have to go 45 sec to 1 minute per mile faster to achieve the same heart rate or else increase the incline. That being said I read that one of the womens olympic marathoners does most of her training on a treadmill because she has a small child at home.
2008-09-18 8:10 PM
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Subject: RE: Explain to me how you HTFU on the run?

Slugger - 2008-09-18 2:53 AM  I respectfully disagree with donskiman: I think right now is exactly when a lot of new runners have to HTFU. Much more so (it seems) than regular runners. The "yeah! I'm gonna do it!" excitement and newness has worn off. The changes have stopped coming as fast. Everyone's stopped asking how you are doing. The initial rush is gone. But, you aren't yet where you want to be. You aren't fast enough. You can't run far enough. It is a struggle to go up that 10%...or 7%...each week. You are desperate to just be there already. This is the time when diets fail. When the equipment goes into the corner and blends in with the plants. The gym membership gets renewed for just one more month. This is the time when you have to dig the deepest. It isn't a habit yet. It isn't ingrained yet. It isn't an absolutely accepted part of your day, week, life yet. It is really freaking hard to just keep going. But that is what you do. You just keep going. You ignore people who say you won't get better until you are running x mpw. You ignore people who say you should run at x pace. You ignore people who say you should do x program, or no program at all. Mostly, though, you ignore the voice in your head that says, "Are we done now? Are we there yet?" The answer is no, and the answer is to HTFU. Just. do. it. Keep putting one foot in front of the other. Change scenery, look around more, get a good long daydream going that you look forward to continuing each day. Find a Really Scary Hill, drive to the bottom of it, and start running. Run as far as you can, then mark your spot where you start walking. Next week, come back to the hill and run it again. And again. Until you crush that sucker. Then find a new challenge. Keep finding new challenges, in the form of races, or hills, or routes, or times of day. That is how to HTFU. Good luck.

 

I think you nailed exactly where I am... Thanks for the boost  Slugger.

2008-09-19 2:12 AM
in reply to: #1679893

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Subject: RE: Explain to me how you HTFU on the run?
You are quite welcome. As you can tell, I've been there. You can do it.
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