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2010-10-31 1:45 PM
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Subject: RE: Cycling Program v3.0 - 2010 - 2011

birdog41 - 2010-10-30 2:18 PM Am I right in assuming that next week's day 1 testing for heart rate users is just a 30 min TT?  Wait I should re-phrase that and not say 'just' and say a grinding 30 min TT test.

You are correct.  However, if you were to train with power it only calls for a 20 min TT. Laughing



2010-10-31 3:10 PM
in reply to: #3154535

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Subject: RE: Cycling Program v3.0 - 2010 - 2011
Jorge, any recommendation for some sort of warm up before the tests?
2010-10-31 6:20 PM
in reply to: #3187448

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Subject: RE: Cycling Program v3.0 - 2010 - 2011
Just had a question about how I will schedule my workouts.  I will try for MWF and sat or sun for the long ride.  Sometimes I work double shifts on mondays and I can't do tuesdays since I've got class after work and am usually home late.  So the weeks I have to do doubles I would have to:

fri - day3
sat - long
sun - day1 
wed - day2

is the fri-sat-sun not good to do consecutive?  Thanks 
2010-10-31 6:34 PM
in reply to: #3154535

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Subject: RE: Cycling Program v3.0 - 2010 - 2011
Hmmmmm, I will definitely be starting this party at a much later date than everyone else.  My leg isn't going to tolerate that intensity for a while yet.
2010-10-31 6:47 PM
in reply to: #3187448

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Subject: RE: Cycling Program v3.0 - 2010 - 2011
shmeeg - 2010-10-31 5:10 PM Jorge, any recommendation for some sort of warm up before the tests?


If you look on Jorge's blog on the right, it gives the details for the tests including the recommended warmup.
2010-10-31 6:53 PM
in reply to: #3154535

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Subject: RE: Cycling Program v3.0 - 2010 - 2011
Crap, you're right.  I've even gone that page a few times already Embarassed.  Thanks.


2010-10-31 10:01 PM
in reply to: #3186510

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Subject: RE: Cycling Program v3.0 - 2010 - 2011
shmeeg - 2010-10-30 1:18 PM
inspectord - 2010-10-29 5:37 PM Day 3 of week 2 prep is completed. I wasn't sure if I was going to be able to finish the last 5 of the 3rd interval but I made it through it.


Just finished this one and had the same thought.  That was a good workout!  I'm already seeing an increase in performance just from these two weeks of prep work. 

For those of you that use WKO+, can I get some pro/cons versus just using Garmin Training Center or Golden Cheetah?  I am reading the Coggan/Allen book, and so far most of what they have discussed, I won't really use.  Is it worth the $125?  Thanks.


You do get a time limited demo of WKO+, so you should be able to have a look at both.  I personally like GC, but only played with WKO+ for a bit.  If you get GC make sure to get a new development build.  They are building great stuff into it these days.
2010-10-31 10:25 PM
in reply to: #3154535

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Subject: RE: Cycling Program v3.0 - 2010 - 2011

I'm sure it's just me and my computer but when I go to Jorge's page and click on the .jpg of each weeks workout  and try to print it I don't get the whole thing on my page, even if I chose landscape.  Can anyone help me do something so that I can print the whole thing?  Now I get only to half of Day 3 and the rest is cut off.
Thanks

2010-10-31 11:07 PM
in reply to: #3187901

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Subject: RE: Cycling Program v3.0 - 2010 - 2011
sand101 - 2010-10-31 5:01 PM
shmeeg - 2010-10-30 1:18 PM
inspectord - 2010-10-29 5:37 PM Day 3 of week 2 prep is completed. I wasn't sure if I was going to be able to finish the last 5 of the 3rd interval but I made it through it.


Just finished this one and had the same thought.  That was a good workout!  I'm already seeing an increase in performance just from these two weeks of prep work. 

For those of you that use WKO+, can I get some pro/cons versus just using Garmin Training Center or Golden Cheetah?  I am reading the Coggan/Allen book, and so far most of what they have discussed, I won't really use.  Is it worth the $125?  Thanks.


You do get a time limited demo of WKO+, so you should be able to have a look at both.  I personally like GC, but only played with WKO+ for a bit.  If you get GC make sure to get a new development build.  They are building great stuff into it these days.


I like WKO because it breaks down some cool stuff like your peak 10s, 30s, etc power and records it over time.

Just looking at my summary page, I can tell you that my peak 1 minute power has gone up from 477 watts in June to 540 watts this month.  Being able to easily have that information is a constant motivation to try and "up" those numbers.

It also is great for disecting your ride.  I can zero in on any point on my ride and get power details.  For example...there is a hill I always attack on my group ride.  I can "highlight" that exact portion of the hill and see exactly how I did.  I can save that portion, and then compare it to other days.

Is it necessary...nope.  Is it cool...for me it is.  Is it worth it to you...only you can answer that.
2010-10-31 11:53 PM
in reply to: #3187945

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Subject: RE: Cycling Program v3.0 - 2010 - 2011
sand101 - 2010-10-31 5:01 PM You do get a time limited demo of WKO+, so you should be able to have a look at both.  I personally like GC, but only played with WKO+ for a bit.  If you get GC make sure to get a new development build.  They are building great stuff into it these days.


True.  Unfortunately I downloaded it months ago and started the trial period trying to load 305 data into it and now I'm SOL for trial period.

tri808 - 2010-10-31 9:07 PM I like WKO because it breaks down some cool stuff like your peak 10s, 30s, etc power and records it over time.

Just looking at my summary page, I can tell you that my peak 1 minute power has gone up from 477 watts in June to 540 watts this month.  Being able to easily have that information is a constant motivation to try and "up" those numbers.

It also is great for disecting your ride.  I can zero in on any point on my ride and get power details.  For example...there is a hill I always attack on my group ride.  I can "highlight" that exact portion of the hill and see exactly how I did.  I can save that portion, and then compare it to other days.

Is it necessary...nope.  Is it cool...for me it is.  Is it worth it to you...only you can answer that.


That's what I'm talkin about!  Thanks.
2010-11-01 8:35 AM
in reply to: #3187658

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Subject: RE: Cycling Program v3.0 - 2010 - 2011

tbcoffee - 2010-10-31 7:20 PM Just had a question about how I will schedule my workouts.  I will try for MWF and sat or sun for the long ride.  Sometimes I work double shifts on mondays and I can't do tuesdays since I've got class after work and am usually home late.  So the weeks I have to do doubles I would have to:

fri - day3
sat - long
sun - day1 
wed - day2

is the fri-sat-sun not good to do consecutive?  Thanks 

 

Just from experience last year, the Day 1 Workout is usually the most intense and is best done well rested.  Do you recover well after your long ride(s)? 



2010-11-01 8:57 AM
in reply to: #3187917

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Subject: RE: Cycling Program v3.0 - 2010 - 2011
cathyd - 2010-10-31 11:25 PM

I'm sure it's just me and my computer but when I go to Jorge's page and click on the .jpg of each weeks workout  and try to print it I don't get the whole thing on my page, even if I chose landscape.  Can anyone help me do something so that I can print the whole thing?  Now I get only to half of Day 3 and the rest is cut off.
Thanks



I suggest opening up MS Word, go to page setup and make it landscape.  Perhaps even narrow down the margins.  Then just copy and past Jorge's .jpg into the Word doc before printing.  That should take care of it for you.

I'm excited about testing this week.  I set up my workouts to be Monday, Tuesday, Thursday and Saturday.  My running is on Sunday (LSD), Monday (short and easy), Wednesday (hill repeats), Thursday (optional short and easy) and Friday (Tempo).  Swim is M/W/F over lunch and Weights are M-F before leaving work so the bike and run are the only things fighting for evening attention.
2010-11-01 8:58 AM
in reply to: #3187917

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Subject: RE: Cycling Program v3.0 - 2010 - 2011
cathyd - 2010-10-31 10:25 PM

I'm sure it's just me and my computer but when I go to Jorge's page and click on the .jpg of each weeks workout  and try to print it I don't get the whole thing on my page, even if I chose landscape.  Can anyone help me do something so that I can print the whole thing?  Now I get only to half of Day 3 and the rest is cut off.
Thanks



Not sure what browser you are using, but for me I use the "print preview" in order to adjust the margins.  I have a pull down next to a printer icon on a toolbar in which to access preview.  Once there I can set the landscape, move out the margins, etc.

2010-11-01 9:06 AM
in reply to: #3186510

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Subject: RE: Cycling Program v3.0 - 2010 - 2011
shmeeg - 2010-10-30 1:18 PM
inspectord - 2010-10-29 5:37 PM Day 3 of week 2 prep is completed. I wasn't sure if I was going to be able to finish the last 5 of the 3rd interval but I made it through it.


Just finished this one and had the same thought.  That was a good workout!  I'm already seeing an increase in performance just from these two weeks of prep work. 

For those of you that use WKO+, can I get some pro/cons versus just using Garmin Training Center or Golden Cheetah?  I am reading the Coggan/Allen book, and so far most of what they have discussed, I won't really use.  Is it worth the $125?  Thanks.


all software have pros and cons depending what are you looking for. WKO, Cheetah or RaceDay allow you to do more in depth analysis and you can also use either Training Stress Score (or Bike Score) to track your training load based on how intense and long each session is with relation to your current fitness level (track via your functional threshold power or critical power). The Garmin center offers a very limited view of the data and you can't do much analysis.
2010-11-01 9:09 AM
in reply to: #3182097

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Subject: RE: Cycling Program v3.0 - 2010 - 2011
GoFaster - 2010-10-29 8:29 AM

I was going to post something similar but haven't gotten around to it yet.

I'll just add the following for those going by HR.  When doing the shorter sets, and the target calls for 95-100%, you should not "feel" like you're going 100%, not even close.  Remember, you're interval is 100% of what you can hold for an hour - not what you can hold for 30 sec, 1 minute, whatever.  When I was doing the 30sec intervals from Q1 for this week's sessions - they were not difficult.  Why?  Because I was supposed to be able to hold that effort for much longer.  So, if you find that you're really pushing yourself and getting gassed, and wondering why - it's cause you're working way, way too hard. Your HR will never catch up to your effort until you're into the middle or end of your main set(s).


Excellent reminder! For those training with HRM, please keep this in mind.
2010-11-01 9:21 AM
in reply to: #3187945

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Subject: RE: Cycling Program v3.0 - 2010 - 2011
tri808 - 2010-10-31 11:07 PM

I like WKO because it breaks down some cool stuff like your peak 10s, 30s, etc power and records it over time.

Just looking at my summary page, I can tell you that my peak 1 minute power has gone up from 477 watts in June to 540 watts this month.  Being able to easily have that information is a constant motivation to try and "up" those numbers.

It also is great for disecting your ride.  I can zero in on any point on my ride and get power details.  For example...there is a hill I always attack on my group ride.  I can "highlight" that exact portion of the hill and see exactly how I did.  I can save that portion, and then compare it to other days.

Is it necessary...nope.  Is it cool...for me it is.  Is it worth it to you...only you can answer that.


Not to be a spokesman for GC, but GC does these.  Make sure you get the latest development build.  They have put in a "Metrics" tab that tracks any number of items, so tracking 1min power over time is no sweat.

It also has the ability to highlight exact portions of rides, find power peaks, finds and records your intervals (which is great for these workouts), etc.

The best feature of GC, though, is the building of your personal critical power graph (and calculation of critical power from that) - I don't remember that in WKO+.



Edited by sand101 2010-11-01 9:23 AM


2010-11-01 9:21 AM
in reply to: #3188271

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Subject: RE: Cycling Program v3.0 - 2010 - 2011
Pector55 - 2010-11-01 8:57 AM
I suggest opening up MS Word, go to page setup and make it landscape.  Perhaps even narrow down the margins.  Then just copy and past Jorge's .jpg into the Word doc before printing.  That should take care of it for you.

I'm excited about testing this week.  I set up my workouts to be Monday, Tuesday, Thursday and Saturday.  My running is on Sunday (LSD), Monday (short and easy), Wednesday (hill repeats), Thursday (optional short and easy) and Friday (Tempo).  Swim is M/W/F over lunch and Weights are M-F before leaving work so the bike and run are the only things fighting for evening attention.


Good stuff Mike!

For all those of you wondering how to adapt this program into your regular tri training well, you'll have to do a bit of tweaking and experimenting to see what works for you. AS you know, this is a cycling focused program that might or might not fit your needs so please, design your program based on your current needs! I'll leave the plan up on my blog after it ends so you can start it later if need it.

Also, consider that some of the sessions I suggest are intense because we are trying to get the best return on investment with tight schedules, but this doesn't mean the program as it stands is the right fit for your needs. If you have an early IM you certainly can do some of the intense sessions but also you'll need to do more specific IM trainnig (long steady state efforts).

if yuor weakness is running, then doing this program 100% might not be the best way to go. Intsead you could do only days 1 and 3 of the program to get a bit bang for your buck (cirtical power wise) but still have 5 days to do address your running. Do easy running day the day before or day off the cycling plan and the other days do more intense/long run days.

If your current focus is swimming, then the cycling program should not get much in the way as long as you can alternate training days or leave time in between sessions (i.e. if doing 2x day do swim in AM and bike in PM).

Finally, if you are following a weight/resistance training program just make sure to not do a strenuous session the day before of your cycling sessions. Many here have the perception I am anti weight lifting though if you ask all y athletes all do some sort of resistance training. What I am against of, is following the populr perception as to what constitutes a good resistance training for endurance sports. For my athletes I include some plyos, fucntional strenght training and lots of specific strength training.

That said, some athletes need to address specific muscle imbalances, injury rehab or simply enjoy weight lifting. In those cases a resistance training (including lifting weights) is adequate and something you have to consider into the mix.3

At the end of the day, do what works for you. This plan is just a blue print for a focused cycling program that can certainly help your increase your cycling critical power and lay down a great foundation for your training on 2011. But the plan is a general one that might address your needs so use common sense and when in doubt, just ask!

Have fun testing this week (no need for red font )
2010-11-01 9:23 AM
in reply to: #3188311

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Subject: RE: Cycling Program v3.0 - 2010 - 2011
JorgeM - 2010-11-01 10:09 AM
GoFaster - 2010-10-29 8:29 AM

I was going to post something similar but haven't gotten around to it yet.

I'll just add the following for those going by HR.  When doing the shorter sets, and the target calls for 95-100%, you should not "feel" like you're going 100%, not even close.  Remember, you're interval is 100% of what you can hold for an hour - not what you can hold for 30 sec, 1 minute, whatever.  When I was doing the 30sec intervals from Q1 for this week's sessions - they were not difficult.  Why?  Because I was supposed to be able to hold that effort for much longer.  So, if you find that you're really pushing yourself and getting gassed, and wondering why - it's cause you're working way, way too hard. Your HR will never catch up to your effort until you're into the middle or end of your main set(s).


Excellent reminder! For those training with HRM, please keep this in mind.

This is the hardest part for me, since my HR really never catches up except for the third workout and the longer intervals.  In the 30 second intervals, I can't get my HR up to 100% FT without an over the top effort.  So do most HR users really go by RPE?  I'm planning to use the testing tomorrow with the HRM for a number, but really I'm planning to focus on my RPE and the cadence/gearing numbers to track my effort going forward.  Does that make sense?
2010-11-01 9:28 AM
in reply to: #3188303

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Subject: RE: Cycling Program v3.0 - 2010 - 2011
JorgeM - 2010-11-01 10:06 AM
shmeeg - 2010-10-30 1:18 PM
inspectord - 2010-10-29 5:37 PM Day 3 of week 2 prep is completed. I wasn't sure if I was going to be able to finish the last 5 of the 3rd interval but I made it through it.


Just finished this one and had the same thought.  That was a good workout!  I'm already seeing an increase in performance just from these two weeks of prep work. 

For those of you that use WKO+, can I get some pro/cons versus just using Garmin Training Center or Golden Cheetah?  I am reading the Coggan/Allen book, and so far most of what they have discussed, I won't really use.  Is it worth the $125?  Thanks.


all software have pros and cons depending what are you looking for. WKO, Cheetah or RaceDay allow you to do more in depth analysis and you can also use either Training Stress Score (or Bike Score) to track your training load based on how intense and long each session is with relation to your current fitness level (track via your functional threshold power or critical power). The Garmin center offers a very limited view of the data and you can't do much analysis.


Jorge - can you provide a little insight into how to use TSS scores to track training loads?

Thanks.
2010-11-01 9:35 AM
in reply to: #3188355

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Subject: RE: Cycling Program v3.0 - 2010 - 2011
wbayek - 2010-11-01 10:23 AM
JorgeM - 2010-11-01 10:09 AM
GoFaster - 2010-10-29 8:29 AM

I was going to post something similar but haven't gotten around to it yet.

I'll just add the following for those going by HR.  When doing the shorter sets, and the target calls for 95-100%, you should not "feel" like you're going 100%, not even close.  Remember, you're interval is 100% of what you can hold for an hour - not what you can hold for 30 sec, 1 minute, whatever.  When I was doing the 30sec intervals from Q1 for this week's sessions - they were not difficult.  Why?  Because I was supposed to be able to hold that effort for much longer.  So, if you find that you're really pushing yourself and getting gassed, and wondering why - it's cause you're working way, way too hard. Your HR will never catch up to your effort until you're into the middle or end of your main set(s).


Excellent reminder! For those training with HRM, please keep this in mind.

This is the hardest part for me, since my HR really never catches up except for the third workout and the longer intervals.  In the 30 second intervals, I can't get my HR up to 100% FT without an over the top effort.  So do most HR users really go by RPE?  I'm planning to use the testing tomorrow with the HRM for a number, but really I'm planning to focus on my RPE and the cadence/gearing numbers to track my effort going forward.  Does that make sense?


It really does have to be by RPE, unless you're getting into the later stages of a 10 or 20 minute interval, for the very reason you stated - your HR will not match your effort.  The 30min test will let you see how where you stand from a speed/cadence/hr perspective (assuming you are on a trainer), and you can track that over time.  But my 2 cents, pay attention to RPE and build most of your interval sessions around how you feel.
2010-11-01 10:23 AM
in reply to: #3154535

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Subject: RE: Cycling Program v3.0 - 2010 - 2011

I'm not exactly sure how to perform the main set on day 2 of week 1 HR based plan.
It reads: MS: 2x15"(5") @ 85-90%. Please help me out.



2010-11-01 10:53 AM
in reply to: #3188548

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Subject: RE: Cycling Program v3.0 - 2010 - 2011
jlux - 2010-11-01 10:23 AM

I'm not exactly sure how to perform the main set on day 2 of week 1 HR based plan.
It reads: MS: 2x15"(5") @ 85-90%. Please help me out.



Did you read the notes and "how to" examples? http://jorgepbmcoaching.blogspot.com/2008/11/winter-cycling-plan-no...
2010-11-01 11:09 AM
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Subject: RE: Cycling Program v3.0 - 2010 - 2011
As the program officially starts today, it is a good time to place a friendly reminder:

Please use this thread to ask any questions you might have. I updated most of the materials from last year including the plan, terminology, downloadable files, etc. hence even if you did the plan last year check out the new stuff. For those just following this year, please read the links under "Cycling Program v3.0" on my blog, most details to your questions will be in there.

Each weekend I'll post a link to my blog/BT log/twitter and Facebook indicating a new training week is up for you to follow. It might be a good idea to start following my blog (http://jorgepbmcoaching.blogspot.com/), just press the 'follow' button at the bottom of the page, or if you have twitter, add me using jorgepbmc or for Facebook our fan page is http://www.facebook.com/pages/PBM-Coaching/354701750392

If you have any question, please check the links first or ask those here and I'll be happy to chime in and help. This works well because some of the members have done the previous editions of the plan and will have valuable experiences, advice or tips to share. Sometimes it might take me a bit longer to respond so please, be patient. Please, do not email with questions regarding this program.

Finally, if you haven't been added to the Google Docs spreadsheet to track your improvements, please let me know asap to add you to the list. You can PM your email address or email me for that.

Thanks for your help and I am looking forward to see you all get fitter and faster for 2011!
2010-11-01 11:12 AM
in reply to: #3188369

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Subject: RE: Cycling Program v3.0 - 2010 - 2011
GoFaster - 2010-11-01 9:28 AM

Jorge - can you provide a little insight into how to use TSS scores to track training loads?

Thanks.


If you use TP or GC (or even RaceDay) you can read this:
http://home.trainingpeaks.com/articles/cycling/the-science-of-the-performance-manager.aspx
http://home.trainingpeaks.com/articles/cycling/creating-a-performance-management-chart.aspx

If you have a more specific question or example, let me know and I'll be happy to help.
2010-11-01 11:21 AM
in reply to: #3188548

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Subject: RE: Cycling Program v3.0 - 2010 - 2011

jlux - 2010-11-01 11:23 AM

I'm not exactly sure how to perform the main set on day 2 of week 1 HR based plan.
It reads: MS: 2x15"(5") @ 85-90%. Please help me out.

 

MS: 2x15' (5') @ 85-90% It is supposed to be minutes...not seconds. 

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