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Half Iron Pace vs Marathon Pace
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 2008-09-22 7:12 PM |
Veteran  151  |  Subject: Half Iron Pace vs Marathon PaceI was wondering if anyone had any thoughts about how the run portion of a HIM compares in pace and feeling to a marathon. Harder, easier, faster,slower etc. I have done a marathon, but am not sure what to expect on my upcoming HIM! |
| 2008-09-22 7:20 PM in reply to: #1689316 |
Cycling Guru 15134  Fulton, MD | Subject: RE: Half Iron Pace vs Marathon Pace First, welcome to BT! As for what to expect? Similar pace probably. A generic formula for what to expect to be able to hold for a pace in different tri events actually has most people able to project their stand alone marathon pace to what they would be able to do in their HIM run portion. Everything hinges on pacing the swim and the bike properly though. You get those wrong, you are in for a brutal 13.1. |
| 2008-09-22 7:29 PM in reply to: #1689316 |
Expert 958 Mississippi | Subject: RE: Half Iron Pace vs Marathon Pace Dang I was wondering the same thing. I did a longer brick yesterday and my HR just kept high. It kinda concerned me, but it felt okay. Pace was faster than I wanted but slowed down and my HR stayed the same, so I went back to original pace. What HIM are you doing Jake? |
| 2008-09-22 8:25 PM in reply to: #1689372 |
Veteran 151 | Subject: RE: Half Iron Pace vs Marathon Pace I did one as well, and saw quite a high hr like you did. I know it's not generally recommended to do as long a brick as I did (56 bike 10 run) but having no HIM experience, I didn't know what pace to run, what my hr would do, and how my body would react to my nutrition and hydration. I'm doing Longhorn 70.3 in Austin! I'm super excited! |
| 2008-09-23 10:38 AM in reply to: #1689316 |
Elite 5316 Alturas, California | Subject: RE: Half Iron Pace vs Marathon Pace So ... how much do you tune down the bike to save yourself for the run in a HIM. If I average like 18 mph for a 60 mile ride, it sounds like I probably want to dial back to 16-17 mph and keep the heart rate down around 135-145 (Z2-3) depending on hills and headwind. I did a half mary at a 8:40 min pace, (same as run portion of Oly) so I should probably start out the run on the HIM around 9:30 and see how it holds, bring it up past mile 6 if I got some left. Does this sound right or is it all "got to figure it out along the way"? I am just looking for impressions I know it will come down to what I can tollerate and my fitness etc. I'm doing Las Vegas Tri on Sunday (first HIM). Edited by Baowolf 2008-09-23 10:39 AM |
| 2008-09-23 4:34 PM in reply to: #1690506 |
| 286 | Subject: RE: Half Iron Pace vs Marathon Pace Baowolf - 2008-09-23 10:38 AM If I average like 18 mph for a 60 mile ride, it sounds like I probably want to dial back to 16-17 mph and keep the heart rate down around 135-145 (Z2-3) depending on hills and headwind. I did a half mary at a 8:40 min pace, (same as run portion of Oly) so I should probably start out the run on the HIM around 9:30 and see how it holds, bring it up past mile 6 if I got some left. Does this sound right or is it all "got to figure it out along the way"? I am just looking for impressions I know it will come down to what I can tollerate and my fitness etc. For my HIM, I tried to keep my HR in that range, but I just couldn't get it down. My plan was to ride 18 MPH on the bike, then average 8:15-8:30 on the run. I felt good on the bike, so ended up at 21 MPH and then only had enough for 8:45 on the run. My plan went out the window, but my time was better than expected. My goal for the NY Marathon is 8:00 pace, but again, I have no idea if that's going to work. Just my limited experience. |
| 2008-09-23 4:38 PM in reply to: #1689316 |
Master 1920 Ann Arbor, MI | Subject: RE: Half Iron Pace vs Marathon Pace I'm not a coach or anything, but one thing to keep in mind is that your HR might be artificially jacked on race day due to race nerves. I have seen my HR AVERAGE over 170 for the run portion of an HIM, when normally I average 155. My limited experience has taught me that if I watched my HR at a race, I would also watch all the other girls in my AG zoom by me. I train with HR, just not when I'm in 'race mode'. And, to the OP, usually your M pace is the same as your HIM pace. |
| 2008-09-23 4:40 PM in reply to: #1689473 |
Expert 958 Mississippi | Subject: RE: Half Iron Pace vs Marathon Pace Jake1008 - 2008-09-22 8:25 PM I did one as well, and saw quite a high hr like you did. I know it's not generally recommended to do as long a brick as I did (56 bike 10 run) but having no HIM experience, I didn't know what pace to run, what my hr would do, and how my body would react to my nutrition and hydration. I'm doing Longhorn 70.3 in Austin! I'm super excited! I'll see you at Longhorn 70.3! I'm super excited too! |
| 2008-09-23 5:09 PM in reply to: #1689316 |
Champion 5781 Northridge, California | Subject: RE: Half Iron Pace vs Marathon Pace Jake1008 - 2008-09-22 5:12 PM I was wondering if anyone had any thoughts about how the run portion of a HIM compares in pace and feeling to a marathon. Harder, easier, faster,slower etc. I have done a marathon, but am not sure what to expect on my upcoming HIM! I can only compare one HIM to my marathons, but the run was easier/faster for me (HIM run: 8:15/mi; MP earlier this year: 8:58/mi). And that was after going harder on the bike than planned, honestly. YMMV... (HIM run was much more painful than standalone half mary, though, that's for sure.) |
| 2008-09-23 5:59 PM in reply to: #1689316 |
Champion 9600 Fountain Hills, AZ | Subject: RE: Half Iron Pace vs Marathon Pace I was having this exact conversation with two guy's the other day at my race. If you are well trained, you Half IM run pace can be very close to your open marathon run pace. It is in my case and others I know. |
| 2008-09-23 7:37 PM in reply to: #1689316 |
Extreme Veteran 508 Fleming Island, FL | Subject: RE: Half Iron Pace vs Marathon Pace I've only done 1 marathon and two half iron distance races. I felt that I ran the marathon slow, but I wasn't sure what to expect and I did beat my 4:00 hour goal and came in at 3:51. Both my HIM distance runs were just under 2:00. FWIW my best half marathon was just under 1:35. |
| 2008-09-23 7:57 PM in reply to: #1689316 |
Resident Curmudgeon 25290 The Road Back Gold member | Subject: RE: Half Iron Pace vs Marathon Pace My only HIM run was 25 seconds/mile slower than the marathon pace I ran six weeks later, but I'll confess to conservative pacing since it was my first HIM, plus it was significantly (35° ) cooler for the marathon. Edited by the bear 2008-09-23 7:58 PM |
| 2008-09-23 8:06 PM in reply to: #1689316 |
Veteran 151 | Subject: RE: Half Iron Pace vs Marathon Pace I think another factor is the fact that the HIM run takes place during a hotter time of the day (more so for some of us)  . I think this throws off the pace for a lot of people. |
| 2008-09-24 6:20 AM in reply to: #1691842 |
| Fishers, IN | Subject: RE: Half Iron Pace vs Marathon Pace Just a note rgetsof; if you can do a 1:35 half, then you should be able to drop that marathon to 3:20 with a little additional endurance work (long runs primarily). There are a variety of calculators that will tell you that but your half PR is way out of wack w.r.t. to your half based on "equivalent performance relationships". That tells me your lactate threshold pace is/was great when you ran your half and your endurance was limiter in your marathon. |
| 2008-09-24 6:31 AM in reply to: #1689316 |
| Fishers, IN | Subject: RE: Half Iron Pace vs Marathon Pace As has been said, this has a lot to do with how hard you hammer your bike portion of the HIM. Personally, I think the main difference for me was that my legs were way more tired-sluggish, but aerobically it was much easier than the later portion of a marathon where I usually am red-lining. |
| 2008-09-24 6:53 AM in reply to: #1689316 |
Pro 4675 Wisconsin near the Twin Cities metro | Subject: RE: Half Iron Pace vs Marathon Pace My last stand alone marathon (2004) was run at 6:34 min/mi pace. My last (2007) competitive (versus one done last winter for training) stand alone half marathon pace was 5:56. My last few HIM runs the past 2 seasons have been done at anywhere from 6:47-7:05 pace. Edited by Birkierunner 2008-09-24 6:59 AM |
| 2008-09-24 6:41 PM in reply to: #1689316 |
Veteran 151 | Subject: RE: Half Iron Pace vs Marathon Pace Great stuff everybody! Thanks for the input! Birkie.....I can't even drive my car that fast! What an inspiration though! |
| 2008-09-24 7:39 PM in reply to: #1692467 |
Extreme Veteran 508 Fleming Island, FL | Subject: RE: Half Iron Pace vs Marathon Pace rc63413 - 2008-09-24 7:20 AM Just a note rgetsof; if you can do a 1:35 half, then you should be able to drop that marathon to 3:20 with a little additional endurance work (long runs primarily). There are a variety of calculators that will tell you that but your half PR is way out of wack w.r.t. to your half based on "equivalent performance relationships". That tells me your lactate threshold pace is/was great when you ran your half and your endurance was limiter in your marathon. I would love to do a marathon around 3:20. I ran the marathon more conservatively because I was dealing with a bum ankle. On my long runs my right ankle would start hurting after about 18 miles and I would have to start walking. I did not want to do any walking for my first marathon so I eased off my normal pace quite a bit. |
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