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Is Ironman approaching the market price tipping point?
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 2013-11-03 3:07 PM |
Pro  6011   Camp Hill, Pennsylvania |  Subject: Is Ironman approaching the market price tipping point?It's been a while since we've had a discussion about this. They've raised the entry for IMFL 2014 another $50 over this year to a new high of $700. (IIRC, four years ago for the 2010 race, it was about $500?) I had two athletes who volunteered yesterday. They were able to get their registration for next year at the race site this morning without any trouble, and didn't complain about the price tag. Another athlete of mine planned on trying to get in online today, but when he saw that they raised the registration another $50 to $700, he and his wife decided it wasn't worth it, and pulled the plug at the last minute. Instead, we're looking at a Rev3 event for him instead, because the cost is about $250 less, and their events tend to offer more for the athlete's family. Since there are more options now, such as Rev3 and Challenge, do you think a lot more people will be likely to choose another event because of the escalating cost or maybe for other reasons too?
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| 2013-11-03 3:23 PM in reply to: TriMyBest |
Pro 4824   Houston | Subject: RE: Is Ironman approaching the market price tipping point? No. Many people will be happy to do Rev3 and other non branded races but still others will only do IM races. When races like IMAZ sell out in 40 seconds and this year they estimate it may not even go live people prove they are willing to pay the price tag. For me personally the $650 entry fee was a fraction of the amount spent this past year. The $50 is a drop in the bucket compared to what people are paying for bikes, wetsuits, nutrition, coaching etc. |
| 2013-11-03 3:27 PM in reply to: TriMyBest |
Veteran 360 Waukegan, IL | Subject: RE: Is Ironman approaching the market price tipping point? The price tag is one thing that will keep me from doing an IM branded race. FOR ME, it's just not worth it. If I ever decided to do an iron distance event, I'd look into something non IM branded. In my life, I can't justify spending that much for a race. |
| 2013-11-03 3:35 PM in reply to: KeriKadi |
Pro 6011 Camp Hill, Pennsylvania | Subject: RE: Is Ironman approaching the market price tipping point? Originally posted by KeriKadi No. Many people will be happy to do Rev3 and other non branded races but still others will only do IM races. When races like IMAZ sell out in 40 seconds and this year they estimate it may not even go live people prove they are willing to pay the price tag. For me personally the $650 entry fee was a fraction of the amount spent this past year. The $50 is a drop in the bucket compared to what people are paying for bikes, wetsuits, nutrition, coaching etc. Ok, then I have a follow up question. What do you think the limit is? $800? $1,000? $1,500? There has to be a point where the market says "that's more than we're willing to pay". I don't know the answer, and don't even have a gut feeling for where the pricing limit is, but I'm curious what others think.
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| 2013-11-03 3:37 PM in reply to: TriMyBest |
Expert 1130 Fernandina Beach, FL | Subject: RE: Is Ironman approaching the market price tipping point? I did IMFL yesterday as my first full distance race. I did it because I live close to PCB and yes because it was IM branded. I wanted the circus and large group of people for my first. I got everything that was offered. I have a hard time believing any race could have the start IMFL does (the fight for the first 400 yards of the swim was awesome). However I'm looking at Rev 3 Ceder Point for my next full. The $200-300 price difference could be used on travel for me, giving me more options. I wish Rev 3 did more full's because they have a bit of a following, and I'm sure Challenge will too. I don't think I'd sign up for a HITS full as I've done some of their races and they're a bit bare bones. |
 2013-11-03 3:55 PM in reply to: TriMyBest |
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| 2013-11-03 4:02 PM in reply to: TriMyBest |
| Subject: ... This user's post has been ignored. |
| 2013-11-03 4:21 PM in reply to: 0 |
| Master 5557 , California | Subject: RE: Is Ironman approaching the market price tipping point? Originally posted by Fred D Originally posted by TriMyBest . Good question Don. I imagine there is some sort of dollar number that puts it beyond the reach of many, but honestly most ironman triathletes are not close at $700 ime. First incomes of ironman athletes tend to be on the higher side. Second as the above poster stated, the entry fee is but a small chunk of the cost overall. Bikes, wheels, coaching, nutrition, clothes, shoes, wetsuits et , etc. I hate to say this but if IMFL was $1,000 it would still sell out. Maybe not as fast, and clearly this is speculation on my part, but it has a ways to go. Originally posted by KeriKadi No. Many people will be happy to do Rev3 and other non branded races but still others will only do IM races. When races like IMAZ sell out in 40 seconds and this year they estimate it may not even go live people prove they are willing to pay the price tag. For me personally the $650 entry fee was a fraction of the amount spent this past year. The $50 is a drop in the bucket compared to what people are paying for bikes, wetsuits, nutrition, coaching etc. Ok, then I have a follow up question. What do you think the limit is? $800? $1,000? $1,500? There has to be a point where the market says "that's more than we're willing to pay". I don't know the answer, and don't even have a gut feeling for where the pricing limit is, but I'm curious what others think.
IM NYC was the tipping point at least right now. The year they ran it was $825 I think (sold out), and then the next year they upped it to $1200 and signups were slow before they canned it. Of course, you have to figure with inflation that prices are going to slowly rise over time, so the limit in 2012 might be a lot different from say, 2017.
Edit: the princes can probably handle $1200 Edited by spudone 2013-11-03 4:24 PM |
| 2013-11-03 4:28 PM in reply to: TriMyBest |
| Expert 2355 Madison, Wisconsin | Subject: RE: Is Ironman approaching the market price tipping point? I thought about this too so I did some research 2014 IM Los Cabos: Open IMTX: Open IMCDA: Open IMLP: Foundation Slots IM Canada: Open IM Colorado: Foundation Slots IMLou: Open IMWI: Foundation Slots IM Tahoe: Open IM Chatt: Sold Out IMFL: Foundation Slots: IMAZ:???? So out of 11 races open for registration as of today we have: 6 Open 3 Open for Foundation Slots 1 Sold Out Yes IMFL and IMAZ sell out within minutes with IMWI and IMLP not far behind, but after that for races that are not in their inaugural year its a bit different. Rev 3 Cedar Point falls on the same day as IMWI and is about 8 hours east, and it has been gaining participants each year. Challenge Penticton had its inaugural year with the expected drop. Where does PC go from here? Well Roth had the same drop and look at it now. IMO I think that IMLP, IMWI, IMFL, and IMAZ will be sellouts or virtual sellouts within the first day, IMWI being the one possible exception here. Although IM Canada, IM Chatt, IM Colordao could become instant sellouts as well. Other then that I think many of these races are reaching their tipping point in price right now The driving force for WTC is the heart of the 30-50 AG's, these people have families, and this is what Challenege and Rev 3 are catering too more. With a deduction in registration prices they have their way of scooping up A LOT of unhappy athletes seeing $750 price tags. I think WTC is starting to flirt with their price tag, already have for some races it seems. |
| 2013-11-03 4:29 PM in reply to: TriMyBest |
| Master 2855 Kailua, Hawaii | Subject: RE: Is Ironman approaching the market price tipping point? Originally posted by TriMyBest It's been a while since we've had a discussion about this. They've raised the entry for IMFL 2014 another $50 over this year to a new high of $700. (IIRC, four years ago for the 2010 race, it was about $500?) I had two athletes who volunteered yesterday. They were able to get their registration for next year at the race site this morning without any trouble, and didn't complain about the price tag. Another athlete of mine planned on trying to get in online today, but when he saw that they raised the registration another $50 to $700, he and his wife decided it wasn't worth it, and pulled the plug at the last minute. Instead, we're looking at a Rev3 event for him instead, because the cost is about $250 less, and their events tend to offer more for the athlete's family. Since there are more options now, such as Rev3 and Challenge, do you think a lot more people will be likely to choose another event because of the escalating cost or maybe for other reasons too?
I just checked the Rev3 site for Cedar Full distance and it's between $425 - $475....not $250. still certainly cheaper than a WTC IM race as for the $700 entry for WTC IM, well....it's expensive but it's only a part, where the hotel, car, airfare, and misc are the main cost factors. |
| 2013-11-03 4:29 PM in reply to: spudone |
| Subject: ... This user's post has been ignored. |
| 2013-11-03 4:31 PM in reply to: Fred D |
| Expert 2355 Madison, Wisconsin | Subject: RE: Is Ironman approaching the market price tipping point? Originally posted by Fred D Originally posted by TriMyBest . Good question Don. I imagine there is some sort of dollar number that puts it beyond the reach of many, but honestly most ironman triathletes are not close at $700 ime. First incomes of ironman athletes tend to be on the higher side. Second as the above poster stated, the entry fee is but a small chunk of the cost overall. Bikes, wheels, coaching, nutrition, clothes, shoes, wetsuits et , etc. I hate to say this but if IMFL was $1,000 it would still sell out. Maybe not as fast, and clearly this is speculation on my part, but it has a ways to go. Originally posted by KeriKadi No. Many people will be happy to do Rev3 and other non branded races but still others will only do IM races. When races like IMAZ sell out in 40 seconds and this year they estimate it may not even go live people prove they are willing to pay the price tag. For me personally the $650 entry fee was a fraction of the amount spent this past year. The $50 is a drop in the bucket compared to what people are paying for bikes, wetsuits, nutrition, coaching etc. Ok, then I have a follow up question. What do you think the limit is? $800? $1,000? $1,500? There has to be a point where the market says "that's more than we're willing to pay". I don't know the answer, and don't even have a gut feeling for where the pricing limit is, but I'm curious what others think.
So is it fair to say with foundation slots at $1400 that could be their cap? Because while the race sold out of general entry, foundation slots are open. See my post on a breakdown of races that are open to GE, FS, or sold out. I think we are getting to tipping points in some demographics. |
| 2013-11-03 4:33 PM in reply to: #4891257 |
| 1660 | Subject: RE: Is Ironman approaching the market price tipping point? WTC could charge 2000 per race and still sell out quite a few of them for sure. When people volunteer just to get as lot for next year, demand is thru the roof. Vineman 70.3 sod out in minutes this week. |
| 2013-11-03 4:38 PM in reply to: bcagle25 |
| Subject: ... This user's post has been ignored. |
| 2013-11-03 4:39 PM in reply to: bcagle25 |
| Master 5557 , California | Subject: RE: Is Ironman approaching the market price tipping point? Originally posted by bcagle25 I thought about this too so I did some research IM Los Cabos: Open -- hills Starting to see a pattern? It's sort of funny considering people who do IM supposedly want a challenge
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IMWI being the outlier - I haven't done it but looks like a hard course.| 2013-11-03 4:49 PM in reply to: 0 |
| Expert 2355 Madison, Wisconsin | Subject: RE: Is Ironman approaching the market price tipping point? Originally posted by spudone Originally posted by bcagle25 I thought about this too so I did some research IM Los Cabos: Open -- hills Starting to see a pattern? It's sort of funny considering people who do IM supposedly want a challenge
Hence why Asheville was never given an IM. And I like this pattern as courses like IMAZ do not excite me in the least bit. So if I were to do an IM next year all my choices are open, and I can virtually find a way into IMWI well into spring from local offers. I never understood the anger with IMLT. Hard course, hard conditions and then everyone complained about the weather, course and T1 tent. Isn't IM supposed to be hard, dealing with adversity, and adapting to changes on the fly (T1 tent)? Im gonna feed this over to ST and see the response on this. Edited by bcagle25 2013-11-03 4:52 PM |
| 2013-11-03 4:51 PM in reply to: spudone |
| Master 2264 Sunbury, Pennsylvania | Subject: RE: Is Ironman approaching the market price tipping point? Originally posted by spudone Originally posted by bcagle25 I thought about this too so I did some research IM Los Cabos: Open -- hills Starting to see a pattern? It's sort of funny considering people who do IM supposedly want a challenge
You're missing IMMT. It did not sell out right away, but is sold out now. (maybe foundation slots) Semi-hilly I am told. |
| 2013-11-03 5:08 PM in reply to: TheClaaaw |
| Master 5557 , California | Subject: RE: Is Ironman approaching the market price tipping point? I never understood the anger with IMLT. Hard course, hard conditions and then everyone complained about the weather, course and T1 tent. Isn't IM supposed to be hard, dealing with adversity, and adapting to changes on the fly (T1 tent)? I had no problem with the course but yeah the weather put me in a bad mood. I like a challenge but hypothermia isn't a challenge - it's just miserable. All that said, I think the anger for many people stemmed from: - T1 bags piled up *uncovered* the day before in a big storm of high wind and freezing rain. Lots of people got the pleasure of changing into iced over clothes. If they want that race to survive for the long term, they really need to find a way to move it back a month or 2. |
| 2013-11-03 5:18 PM in reply to: spudone |
| Champion 7704 Williamston, Michigan | Subject: RE: Is Ironman approaching the market price tipping point? I don't do IMFL because its branded I do it because its drivable and easy. The housing is easy and cheep the venue is easy and my friends and family know it well. I don't have a big drive to do a bunch of different races. When my now 75 year old parents come they know where to go and what to do. I have a busy ;life and I am willing to pay for easy. |
| 2013-11-03 5:22 PM in reply to: The Chupacabra |
 Bronze member | Subject: RE: Is Ironman approaching the market price tipping point? Originally posted by The Chupacabra The price tag is one thing that will keep me from doing an IM branded race. FOR ME, it's just not worth it. If I ever decided to do an iron distance event, I'd look into something non IM branded. In my life, I can't justify spending that much for a race. Agree but the price tag is not the only thing that would keep me from doing an IM. Something about that 100+ mile ride followed by a marathon! But yes, I can't get passed the race fee to even contemplate the distance. My brain turns off just hearing that amount. I had a friend race Steelhead HIM this summer and I thought it would be fun to race it as a team with her husband taking over the run for me. That would have cost $350 - totally not worth it TO ME. I stayed home and raced a HIM Aqua/bike for a very cheap price
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| 2013-11-03 5:33 PM in reply to: Fred D |
| 225 | Subject: RE: Is Ironman approaching the market price tipping point? Originally posted by Fred D Originally posted by TriMyBest . Good question Don. I imagine there is some sort of dollar number that puts it beyond the reach of many, but honestly most ironman triathletes are not close at $700 ime. First incomes of ironman athletes tend to be on the higher side. Second as the above poster stated, the entry fee is but a small chunk of the cost overall. Bikes, wheels, coaching, nutrition, clothes, shoes, wetsuits et , etc. I hate to say this but if IMFL was $1,000 it would still sell out. Maybe not as fast, and clearly this is speculation on my part, but it has a ways to go. Originally posted by KeriKadi No. Many people will be happy to do Rev3 and other non branded races but still others will only do IM races. When races like IMAZ sell out in 40 seconds and this year they estimate it may not even go live people prove they are willing to pay the price tag. For me personally the $650 entry fee was a fraction of the amount spent this past year. The $50 is a drop in the bucket compared to what people are paying for bikes, wetsuits, nutrition, coaching etc. Ok, then I have a follow up question. What do you think the limit is? $800? $1,000? $1,500? There has to be a point where the market says "that's more than we're willing to pay". I don't know the answer, and don't even have a gut feeling for where the pricing limit is, but I'm curious what others think.
We could make a quick little open text field survey to see what people here thing :P |
| 2013-11-03 6:09 PM in reply to: trigal38 |
| Master 8247 Eugene, Oregon Bronze member | Subject: RE: Is Ironman approaching the market price tipping point? Same here. Not considering an IM in the foreseeable future (maybe never!) but the price tag would put me off a branded race. I guess what really bothers me is throwing all that money almost a year out for the high-demand races and, with that frame of time and the wear and tear of IM training, having there be a pretty distinct possibility that I'd be unable to even start due to injury or other life events. I've seen that happen to multiple people on BT. If I actually did the event, I guess I MIGHT not mind paying a little extra to know that it was being put on by reputable people who (it seems usually) know what they're doing with medical support, logistics, etc. and/or to race in a desirable location, but if I didn't do the race, that's an amazing amount of money to throw away. I don't have the high income that many triathletes have, so to make that up, it would mean a sacrifice like canceling a vacation or visit home. If I did do an IM, I'd probably look for a well-established, non-branded race for my first one. I had a very positive experience with my first HIM (Chelanman in Washington State), which was a non-branded one and quite small, so I'm not necessarily stuck on the IM brand. Yes, my HIM was bare-bones--generic finisher medal, water bottle for winning my AG, generic T-shirt (several races were run concurrently), no finisher's photos-- but it was a beautiful course, there was great support, and it was worth the $175 I paid for it! That being said, for most people the price probably isn't at the tipping point. |
| 2013-11-03 6:21 PM in reply to: TriMyBest |
| Champion 6962 Atlanta, Ga | Subject: RE: Is Ironman approaching the market price tipping point? I think as long as they keep 'boiling the frog' the price tag will not be an issue until they hit 4 digits. $50 here, $50 there and people will complain while inputting their VISA number. |
| 2013-11-03 6:41 PM in reply to: bigevilgrape |
| Member 166 Delco, PA | Subject: RE: Is Ironman approaching the market price tipping point? Originally posted by bigevilgrape Originally posted by Fred D We could make a quick little open text field survey to see what people here thing :P Originally posted by TriMyBest . Good question Don. I imagine there is some sort of dollar number that puts it beyond the reach of many, but honestly most ironman triathletes are not close at $700 ime. First incomes of ironman athletes tend to be on the higher side. Second as the above poster stated, the entry fee is but a small chunk of the cost overall. Bikes, wheels, coaching, nutrition, clothes, shoes, wetsuits et , etc. I hate to say this but if IMFL was $1,000 it would still sell out. Maybe not as fast, and clearly this is speculation on my part, but it has a ways to go. Originally posted by KeriKadi No. Many people will be happy to do Rev3 and other non branded races but still others will only do IM races. When races like IMAZ sell out in 40 seconds and this year they estimate it may not even go live people prove they are willing to pay the price tag. For me personally the $650 entry fee was a fraction of the amount spent this past year. The $50 is a drop in the bucket compared to what people are paying for bikes, wetsuits, nutrition, coaching etc. Ok, then I have a follow up question. What do you think the limit is? $800? $1,000? $1,500? There has to be a point where the market says "that's more than we're willing to pay". I don't know the answer, and don't even have a gut feeling for where the pricing limit is, but I'm curious what others think.
Any results page viewable for that survey? I responded! |
| 2013-11-03 6:48 PM in reply to: bcagle25 |
| 59 | Subject: RE: Is Ironman approaching the market price tipping point? Originally posted by bcagle25 I thought about this too so I did some research 2014 IM Los Cabos: Open IMTX: Open IMCDA: Open IMLP: Foundation Slots IM Canada: Open IM Colorado: Foundation Slots IMLou: Open IMWI: Foundation Slots IM Tahoe: Open IM Chatt: Sold Out IMFL: Foundation Slots: IMAZ:???? So out of 11 races open for registration as of today we have: 6 Open 3 Open for Foundation Slots 1 Sold Out
My $0.02. Los Cabos, TX, and CDA are all really early season meaning that the northern clime folks have a harder time training for those. |
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