Developing IM speed: experience or training?

I'm not sure how to say what is "preferable" (let alone what a "respectable" time would be) since that depends on your goals and what you want out of the experience.

But, if your goal is to get substantially faster than your current expectation of 11-11:30, then doing more IMs is probably not your best path (not that it can't work, though).  Do more short races where you can really work on boosting your threshold paces.  Once you have the "capability" to go as fast as you would like, then you can work on the full endurance and execution skills of the IM distance.

forget the time for now. Embrace the process. As you train and get closer a finish time will get into your head, but in an event that long you don't really know what will happen until the rubber meets the road. Focus on the execution of your race, and the time will come to you.

Well, you can't just forget about time altogether, but you shouldn't dwell on other people's numbers either.  JK had some good thoughts above...you really need to figure out what you want out of this whole adventure.  As you mentioned, the thread title might not be the best because IM and "speed" don't necessarily go together.  Your IM splits won't be faster than you have (or should anyway) experienced in training.  I love racing as part of training as much as anyone but you also need to build great bike fitness in training so that you can come off the bike in your IM and be prepared to run.  So, don't just focus on what speeds you need for your IM splits in order to achieve a goal time but also focus on what training you will need to do in order to achieve the swim, then the bike, and finish the run strongly instead of a death march.  If you focus your training only on IM split speeds (i.e. if you don't exceed those in training) you will be in for a verrrrrrry long day come race time. 

There is always someone faster... and someone slower. 

Developing speed is training with some genetics thrown in. 

To know if your goal was realistic or not, I'd have to look at your past races, your training, etc. Maybe it is? Maybe it isn't. But yeah, if you are doing a 17 mph average in training, busting out a 21 mph average on race day probably isn't going to happen. 

Skinny legs have nothing to do with it. Have you see the cycling pro's who do distance? They are sticks! 

Good luck!  

I am not a vet of IM so this is just an opinion based on no experience.

My goal for my first (1 month away) is to finish. My next goal is to finish well, I want to feel that I executed well, that my training was enough to get me comfortably to the line, and I want to have a great time. I want to feel like I left it all out there, but I don't want that feeling to be at the beginning of the marathon.

My final goal that I only say to myself is to finish below a certain time. It is not so much a goal as a "that would be awesome" icing on the cake sort of thing. I think my first paragraph will be enough for me to be happy with for my first IM, as I have zero idea of what to expect and how a full IM will go.

All that said, IM is expensive and time consuming. I will decide after this race if I will do another. But if I do another there will be a firm time goal in mind, and I will not sign up until I feel I can get to that time goal. I am ok with finishing and finishing well for my first. But I will not keep doing IM just to finish. Any subsequent IM's will be very goal oriented. Realistically for me that means I probably will not do another for 2-3 years. I have never been and still do not feel like a "runner". I want 2-3 years of solid running behind me (without injury) before I will take on the time and money cost of an IM again.

So for you OP, first, don't set your goals based on other people, take a realistic look at your own level and get a time based on that. Keep the time in the back of your mind if you want, but don't focus on it, don't beat yourself up if you are off the pace. The last thing you want to do is be off the pace on the bike, hammer too hard then have a sub-par run.

Focusing on your overall time I feel is a mistake especially for your first IM. You seem to have seriously fast friends but that is not the norm. Most folks don't execute their first IM perfectly and leave time on the table due to pacing and/or nutrition mistakes.

What was your 70.3 splits? What course? What IM are you doing?

Most folks are hour slower if you take your 70.3 double it if on a similar type course...slower folks more than an hour and faster maybe less.

Enjoy the journey and let speed and time fall where it will. You will learn during this IM training and racing cycle and use that going forward to see what is best way to train going forward. Many folks jump right into IM training when spending a few years building up distance is a better way to develop as a triathlete but most people don't want to wait but go straight to an IM.

Only you know what will be satisfying to you.

Training harder is not necessarily answer to be faster but consistency over time. 2 years of racing is not much unless you were runner, bike racer or swimmer in the past.

Getting to the finish line in 12 hours requires that you get to the start line healthy enough to realistically do the race that fast.  Same goes for doing it in 11 or 10 hours.  

You're 2-3 months away from your race.  If you want to go 3-5 km/hr faster than you're realistically expecting right now, you'll need to train more aggressively which SIGNIFICANTLY increases your chance of injury.  Only you can decide if going faster is worth the extra risk of not even starting the race or limping through a 15-hour day.  Don't expect to miraculously find that additional speed...

Be careful with goal creep...you started out thinking <12:00 was something you could achieve with proper training.  A good training day opens the mind to modifying that goal...maybe 11:30 instead of 11:58...Unfortunately, a single training day may not be a good measure of race-day performance, particularly if you're focused on the one awesome day and not the 16 other days around it that weren't nearly so good.  

An IM race is an expensive commitment for both cash and time.  If you have enjoyed training for this one and get to the start line still excited for what you've done, consider hiring a coach to develop a training plan to get you as fast as your peers.  

Not looking to "start something", but at what finish time would it be ok to get a tattoo?  Why wouldn't finishing in the allotted time make it ok?  Why would it even matter if you finished 1sec ahead of the allotted time; isn't that still considered finishing within the rules of the race?  This has nothing to do with me personally as I don't see myself ever doing an IM due to the amount of training required...  Just curious.

I don't know dude.....anyone who can breaststroke for 2.4 miles, coast along on the bike for 112 miles, and then walk 26.2 miles has my respect......I'd be so bored I'd be looking for a tree and a rope. 

Seriously, different stroke, huh?  I have NO desire to do an IM in that fashion, and I DO respect the people who can.  I don't want to do anything for 17 hours straight.

OP:  I wouldn't worry so much about finishing time...especially comparing yourself to others.  For an IM, you basically go out there and do what you can do.  You can't will yourself to a 11 hour finish...you either have the fitness (along with weather cooperating) or you don't.  Chasing the clock is a recipe for disaster.

That said, you better finish well before 17 hours otherwise you'll get no respect from your colleagues.  

All you tattoo people need to get your own thread...

As for the OP, a finishing time is not a goal, it is an outcome. Goals are things within your control, and in long course racing you should really focus on the things you can control, and not worry about the things you can't. Funny thing is that if you do the first really well, the latter usually works out satisfactorily also. 

Here's the thing.  It's your problem.  Not theirs.  You've made an arbitrary decision about what is right and wrong and imposed that framework on others.  It's not their problem (nor should it be thier concern) that they don't fit into your framework.

If I want to finish an IM in less than 12 hours, I can train specifically to achieve that goal.  I can plan out what I'll need for S/T1/B/T2/R splits and I can train to achieve those outcomes.  Do I hit these outcomes in the race?  Maybe, maybe not.  I don't get credit for hypothetical finishes.  This is my goal for B2B this fall, and to achieve that I know I'll need to swim around 1:10, bike around 6:00, and run around 4:30 with 20 minutes for T1 & T2 together.  I know that my long rides need to support averaging 18.6-19 mph for 112 miles and slacking those rides at 17.5 mph won't get me what I want.  (I'm not knocking 17.5 mph averages, just that they won't get *me* what *I* want.)  Even if I've hit the training paces I expect, there isn't a guarantee that I can hit it during the race.  Weather, mechanical, etc. can affect the outcome, but I'd be disappointed if I weren't prepared to take advantage of "perfect" race conditions.  

Setting a goal of "top-3" or "top-25%" puts me at risk of who else shows up and how they perform, which I cannot control.  I don't set those kinds of goals.  

It's very clearly arbitrary.  And if you're still not sure, re-read your last sentence a few times and think it over.  You may have a reasonable point to make, but it still doesn't change the fact that it's an arbitrary line you've drawn.  Also, as an aside, ridiculing others seems a peculiar way to achieve the societal goals you appear to have.