Good Morning, MG!   We survived Father's Day - had a blast.  Friends came over for dinner - the friends that we're doing IMAZ with - so we talked shop until our big girls (the 21 y/o) got up and did all the dishes out of disgust!

Heading up to Seattle tomorrow.....yeah!  Celebrating the anniversary by runing with Steve, Ryan and Kyla!!  Can't wait to meet the guys, and give Kyla her good luck in CdA HUG!!!

Countdown time for Vineman - 4 weeks until race day, Kim!!  We need to try to get a Tunitas in before then.

Hoping ya'll have a great day!  (I think that's Texan, right?)

So its twodays post-race and I have two observations, 1 good 1 bad, about where I am at:

Good: I do not think the bike split was an abberation. I rode my trainer for 2 hours last night and was cranking away without even trying. It was supposed to be an easy ride and I averaged a little under 19, but my legs felt good the whole time and the hills were not an issue. So going forward I am hopefully to see continued improvement here.

Bad: I cannot seem to develope the same focus on the run as I can on the bike. On the bike I can get tunnel vision and tune out any aches or pain and put the hammer down. On the run I am a mess mentally. I let every pain or ache get to me. I do not make good decisions either. None of these pains are injuries, but rather are the normal achings, stitiches and hard breathing we all experience. I need to learn to turnthem out!

Now it may be that I am trying to run beyond my training level. I still have low mileage for the year. I am also only about 1/2 way toward my weight loss. My A race is not until 10/29, so I should just chill, but being the tri-focus idiot that I am I cannot stop from analyzing everything.

Just wanted to do a brain dump. Suggestions for improving my mental focus while running are VERY welcome.

Congratulations, Triathlete!!! So happy for you!!!

Suzy- Sorry about the race. Sounds like some crazy weather

Rob- Congrats on the PB!!!

Jayne- You are going to do great at your tri this weekend! You've put in the training and preparation, and armed with Suzy and Kyla's checklists you're all set to go. Enjoy every moment!

Linda- Happy Anniversary! Have a great time!

After seeing Sam's almost completely swolen shut eye, I keep waiting for her to say "cut me mick!"

X 1 million!!!! Runners please help a couple of MG brothers out!!

OK, I'll bite... Side stitches and hard breathing say to me you are running too hard/too fast for where you are right now. I'd say SLOW IT DOWN for awhile and see how that goes. Do you train with HR at all? That can be a helpful gauge, but it's not the be-all, end-all. I feel slightly out of breath at the start of each run (like going up stairs in high altitude) but after about 2 minutes it eases up. There are the easy-to-follow rules about talking. Are you running at a conversational pace? Like can you talk in complete sentences? If not, then try slowing down. If you can only blurt out 1-2 word responses, then you are likely running more at a "tempo" pace which should be reserved for only a few miles a week, provided you have that solid base. 

I can run for hours (literally) and the only thing I feel is some cumulative leg fatigue over time. Breathing stays even. HR stays relatively stable (slow creep on longer efforts). I count my breaths when I run... I usually breathe out for 3 paces (left/right/left leg, for example), and breathe in for 2. When I am working hard, then it changes to a 2/2 -- hills, speedwork, kick at the end. If I find myself breathing 2/2 for any basic runs, I know I am pushing too hard.

You had me @ BITE

This is a great topic.  I have been thinking about the same thing, but in reverse order.  I can take quite a  bit of pain on the run and really get focused (although more often in stand alone races), but I have a devil of a time doing that for long periods on the bike.  You might be onto something with experience and miles in the bank.  Been running since '03, but only biking three years, two seriously.  Curious what others have to say.

Doug, I would try to let the weight excuse go (said nicely).  You can still get to a place of pain and hold it regardless of weight.  Yes, you may be faster as you get lighter, but that doesn't affect the mental component.  GO back and read a few of your race reports.  You end it with the same thing....you are working on that perceived flaw so you gotta drop it mentally for now. I think it is standing in your way.

Trevor, if you want to make a funny, get the quote right!!!! 

You had me AT bite.  Silly Canadian.

I agree with Kyla about fitness, and it's something I struggle with on the bike.  No matter how hard I focus, it is just way harder for me to gut through the pain on the bike compared to how I can on the run...and I've attributed it to my bike fitness being nowhere near the level of my run fitness.  It's almost like the only thing stopping me from going faster or harder on the run is my lungs, whereas on the bike, my legs give up much earlier than I would like...even in zone 3.  I'm working on it, but it's very hard, for sure! 

Usually, that same issue affects me on the run off of the bike, however last weekend's olympic was somewhat of a breakthrough, and I felt like at the least I was giving a half marathon effort on that run for the whole 6.2 miles.  I think it is because I went for high zone 3 instead of zone 4 on the bike.  A few minutes extra on the bike and I felt like it gave me a much better run. 

Now, the question of how to build run fitness....I hate to make generalizations, but what has worked for me is:  lots of easy zone 1/2, some zone 4/5, and not so much in between.   Kind of like Kyla said.  Just feeling kind of verbose today! 

Congrats to all of our racers this weekend.  Chris, you are a bona fide triathlete, now!!!!  Way to go!   

eta: trevor, you fixed it.  boy, i wish i had quoted that!!!! 

She does... I have ran with her, bike with her, and swam with her... She can't multi task.... Her chain was CONSTANTLY falling off her bike last week because she couldn't talk and shift at the same time.

I will say though Doug... It is a mental thing with you.  Just know that you are going to get in the "hurt locker" and overcome it.  When you are racing to you tell yourself that it a "mere 5k" and that there is ABSOLUTELY NO WAY that I am going to walk during a 5k run?  You have a serious internal battle going on there and you need to find out what it takes for you to get out of it.... What are you basing your times on?  What you SHOULD BE running based on your training, or what others around you are doing?

OK, BITE ME!!!

Once is not constantly!! And yeah, I'll admit to my lack of cycling multitasking. Ride alone for 100's of hours and then add two yahoos to the mix... A girl is gonna get distracted. But Steve, I'll say it was distraction from your awesome calves!!! (See how much nicer I am than you??!!)

The team would probably revoke my card-carrying, true Kool-Aide drinking, EN athlete status if I didn't post the following on this discussion. (Fatty???)  Although written from a 140.6 perspective, I know from experience that it applies to the middle distance races as well......

http://www.trifuel.com/training/triathlon-training/the-endurance-nation-%E2%80%9Cfour-keys%E2%80%9D-to-ironman-execution-updated

I also agree with the Sensei in that you have to know what the inside of YOUR "Hurt Locker" looks like, and how long YOU can stay inside said locker, but how early or how late you arrive there is purely based on race execution.  

I have to say that this is precisely what I find so valuable about the MG.  It is nice to know that some MG'ers are having precisely the same issues I am, and that others have ideas and answers for those issues.

I am going to George out on the RR - because I am hosting a 80 person party at the house tomorrow night and time is short.  Basic version:  felt good on the swim, and had a great bike, but the run was painful.  And PAINFUL like I do not remember painful.  Not in an injury sort of way, but in a "Holy cow, this really sux" sort of painful.  And my glutes and hamstrings were acting up -- I would not describe them as screaming, but they were making their objections known. 

Overall, coming out of T2, I was 3:05 faster my PR.  And finishing the race, I was 3:10 slower than my my PR.  So I lost 6:15 on a 10k run, which is basically 1 min per mile slower than my previous pace.  I know the "there is no such thing as a great bike followed by a horrible run" thing, but I did not think I pushed myself too hard on the bike.  I felt like I was within the zone of the reasonable for me.  I am still trying to figure out how to correct this issue.  I think foam rolling and massages will help with the glutes and hamstrings.  But I think there is more to it than that. 

It will just take some time reflecting on this.  But the exchanges so far about running pace are helpful.  Any and all other suggestions are welcome. 

This is a helpful discussion.

To Suzy: I know I should drop the "excuse" but what I am finding now is that my running mechanics are slowly improving as I get smaller. There is less of me getting in my own way.

Kim: It seems we are opposites. I am built to bike. Once I find my rhythm on the bike I just work to a cadence that is right on a good line for me. I imagine my legs are pistons and just keep me knees rising and falling at the right pace. If I do get some weariness, I pull up more on my pedals to spread out some of the work to other leg muscles and give my quads a little break.

I do not use and zones on the bike. Never have. It is all RPE.

Birdy: You are spot on. That is where I need to focus. I need to tell myself things like "It is only a 5K!" "Any pain will be over in only a few minutes." "Find a pace you can maintain." etc.

I am not racing to a specific time and I am not racing the other racers while I am on the run. I am in survival mode. I wish I had the run fitness to reach that level of strategy on the run, but I don't JUST yet! I will get it.

I have met some on the MG members: Tony, Sam, John, Tracy, and Linda and I don't think any of tem would characterize me as what a typical runner looks like. This is the least natural of the three disciplines for me. So perhaps I need to cut myself some slack, run the whole thing at whatever pace it takes to complete that distance and just get it done. The funny thing is I can actually go away in my mind in the water and on the bike, but I am right there for every step on the run.

I agree, and I'd add to this to spread the volume out over more frequent, shorter runs instead of lumping it all into 2 or 3 longer runs per week.

In races, are you running hard straight out of T2? It's really easy to run faster than you think you are coming out of T2, and that can set you up to crash later in the run.

race report up

http://www.beginnertriathlete.com/discussion/forums/thread-view.asp?tid=257408

I wore a HRM the tri before last so my coach could see my data AFTER the race. I did not use it during the race. I did spike coming out of T2 so I deliberately ran easier this time. I have thought about this for the last hour and really think that this is a mental thing for me. I had no hamstring/achillies/back/quad issues. The pain was all the typical pain one experiences when exerting onself. I could control my breathing rate by controlling my running speed. I NEED to get my head on straight on the run.

I race this coming Sunday and will try to work it out. Maybe I can write song titles on my arm and just sing them to myself the whole way!

It is good to be known for something...

"I am going to George out on the RR" -  William

"I 'm  Georgeing on the RR" - Trevor

"With George like speed, RR is finally up" - Dino 

"Pulling a George, RR tomorrow" - Kim

 "RR & details tomorrow.  (Just call me George!)" - Dino

"With George like speed ....   RR is up. " - Dino

PS - some of you have to pick it up.  Dino is killing it! 

Okay, so can those of you who are good at beating the mental demons in the pain cave give us some tips? I need help with this, too!

From you RR:

Seems like 4 minutes could easily be made up there. John could probably help you get T1 down to 125 minutes!!