What is 'too hard' and 'unfair'?

If everybody had to do the same course - then there really isn't anything 'unfair' about it.  This time, it was hills, but next time, it can be an unpredicted 100+ degree temps which would also slow people down 2-3 minutes/mile!

I agree, you can say a course was hard, or even you found it too hard for your fitness and planning. However, unfair would be if you had to carry a clydesdale on your back up those hills while no one else did.

Other good descriptions-A sufferfest, like working with Sisyphus, elevation changes more frequent than my wife changes her mind, steeper than the descent into hades, the RD must have been high when he planned it.

Hope that helps!

Completely agree.   Unless the course was changed last minute so participants didn't have the chance to review the course there is nothing unfair about it.  And too hard for one person might just be a great course for someone who has been training those conditions. 

My opinion is there's no such thing as unfair because everyone is running the same course, so technically it's fair to everyone.

Now as for too hard, as you stated it's a very subjective thing that would be difficult for people to agree upon.  I think race directors have a balance that they need to strike where they throw in enough challenges to make it interesting, but if they make a race too challenging then nobody will race it the next year.

For me, I don't really have a too hard threshold, but I do use terms like "that was just mean, to put that hill there".  I did a cross country style race last fall and it was brutal.  there were so many steep climbs that you had to put your hands on the ground and they even had ropes in some areas to help you pull yourself up the hill.  That was brutal, but I wouldn't say it was "too hard" and I'll do it again this year.

I, personally, would be hard pressed to use words like "unfair" or "too hard" in a race review.  It can't be unfair if everyone had to do it, and "too hard" is subjective. 

Now if the race folks pitched it as a "flat and fast" run course, maybe you've got a point, but otherwise saying "it was too hard..." without immediately following it with "... for me" just sounds like complaining.

Say it was a very challenging run course that consisted of multiple steep climbs and descents that reduced you to walking at points, and resulted in you averaging 2-3 minutes per mile off your regular pace.

The last two events I did in May - a hilly duathlon and a flat sprint triathlon - there was a middle-aged father there competing with his severely disabled adult son. He had a modified bike and running stroller and carried his son through the events. I doubt hard or unfair entered his mind or anyone who saw him race. Totally emotional seeing his son waving back at us as we cheered him on.

Heh. Living in cold, hilly Lake Placid 100+ degree heat would slow me down a HELL of a lot more than even vicious hills.  To answer the question, I would have to say that hills aren't "unfair" since every competitor has to go up and down the same ones.  Maybe instead of "too hard" you can put something more descriptive and helpful to others like "extremely hilly" or "more mountainous than Pamela Anderson and Dolly Parton combined." 

There is no such thing as "too hard" or "Unfair"  only quitters use those terms.  Sorry to be harsh but that is the truth.  If I read an article that told me a race was "Too hard" I'd go run it just to prove you are weak.

Not trying to be a hard azz but that is the mentality of most triathletes.  The reason most of us are here is the challenge not because it's easy.

HTFU

"Too hard" is relative term, so you better qualify the comparison and not leave it empty.

Too Hard for a first Tri?

Too Hard for someone ill-prepared?

I won't touch "unfair".

Did every competitor not run the same course?

Unless they changed the rules or course between waves (Which can happen, if water conditions turn a Tri into a Du...), the course is usually pretty fair.

A 500' climb for me is likely to be a 500' climb for the next competitor.

I know for the Super-frog, they spend a serious amount of time letting us know that we will be running on the sand.

They are definitely setting themselves to say, "We told ya."

suck it up buttercup

Seriously though, everybody has to do the same course, some will handle it better than others. If you found it tough then draw stregth from your experiences and prepare yourself for next time.

The challenge of seeing what I can do on any given day is what I enjoy most out of Triathlon, if it was easy it'd be boring and I wouldn't be doing it. Just give it your best and you've nothing to be ashamed about.

Happy Training.

Rich

Yeah, I do. My threshhold is "unsafe". Everything else is fair game.

I am really curious about the event.

You had a 5k on your race list.

I want to see how it was presented.

If I didn't PR each leg it was "too hard".

If I didn't win it was "unfair".

I would just say the course kicked my .

However, I could see how it might be viewed as unfair if you had been pacing yourself with the understanding that the course was going to be faster based on the race description. Best thing to do is to look at the course maps and check out the course yourself before you go.

Always expect there to be hills on courses that say flat and fast. I ran a marathon last fall (my first) that was advertised as flat and fast, but the last 10 miles were rolling and it killed my legs causing me to fall off my pace that I had trained for for the previous 6 months. I didn't question the fairness of the course, but it does kind of make me question why race organizers use these terms so liberally.

Ever since then, I have been training hills on every run to try and make them my friends. I have become somewhat masochistic because I never want them to limit me again. I am always trying to find the hilliest courses so that way I know I'm prepared. It gives me a huge mental edge.

Really?  Is this serious?  I mean, really?  The race organizers owe you nothing except honesty and reasonable measures to protect safety.  If you didn't like the race, then don't go back. 

Please tell us you're joking.  (Or trolling -- if so, nice one.)

actually if the RD brags how flat the bike and run course is and you get there and its basically mountain climbing then its kinda unfair.  If you know the run will be way harder than usual you might save more for it.

Also hidden rules like set cut off times when they do not publish them are clearly unfair. 

One reason I like triathlons everyone gets to start at the same time who you compete against.  If Chicago tri was like the Chicago marathon and people just start based on their projected finishing times then it would be unfair if you start 2 hours earlier and weather changes dramatically for the worse before everyone else even got to start.

Well the race directors may not have been honest about the course. Then it would be unfair advertising. When put in that context, I don't think the OP is being a wimp. I would imagine a super sprint may have been marketed towards beginners and could have been advertised as an easy tri or great beginner tri. All speculations on my part...

If I can politely ask the folks who are posting HTFU to CTFD (calm the f down), please let me try again.  I didn't mean to come across as whining or complaining.  I was literally trying to describe what made it hard to me.

Unfair is highly value laden.  Obviously everyone had to do the same race.  That phrase was in my head because of the description below.  Misrepresented?  Incredibly underrepresented?  Savageman bills itself as ‘savage’.  Plenty of other races revel in their severity.  I don’t want this to devolve into a conversation about how accurately organizers should describe their courses.  Clearly, ‘unfair’ is too inflammatory for legitimate conversation.  Let’s abandon that term and move on.

“After taking in the scenery on the bike athletes will get to explore Salem with a 5K run on a mixture of roads and sidewalks.”

Too hard is also value laden to a degree.  It obviously wasn’t too hard for people who ran much faster than I did.  It was definitely too hard for me given my condition and training.  It wasn’t so hard that I didn’t finish, finished DFL, or made an unscheduled stop at the funeral home on the course. 

The race report section gives us each the opportunity to rate a race as ‘too easy,’ “just right’ or ‘too hard’ based on your abilities.  Those of you who will NEVER click ‘too hard’ need not reply.  I was looking for opinions from folks who could conceive of rating a race course as too hard.