General Discussion Triathlon Talk » Run improvement - is this a reasonable goal Rss Feed  
Moderators: k9car363, alicefoeller Reply
2012-11-02 7:53 AM


106
100
Subject: Run improvement - is this a reasonable goal

Just started tri training this past May, before that zero running experience other than high school sports 10 years ago.

I did a training run 13.1 miles in 2:06 (9:20 min/mile), but it was on a pretty hilly course compared to where i live and where I plan to race next year. 

I am just starting on a slightly modified BarryPs running plan where I'll be running 5 days a week this week i'll be doing 21 miles and increasing 1 mile/week.

Currently 6ft1in 215 lbs, hoping to loose another 10-15 lbs by next spring.

Question is that I would like to be about to run a half marathon by next June in about 1:30-1:40, is this a reasonable expectation/goal?

Thanks in advance.



2012-11-02 7:57 AM
in reply to: #4480078

User image

Champion
9407
500020002000100100100100
Montague Gold Mines, Nova Scotia
Subject: RE: Run improvement - is this a reasonable goal
TrBeau17 - 2012-11-02 9:53 AM

Question is that I would like to be about to run a half marathon by next June in about 1:30-1:40, is this a reasonable expectation/goal?


Maybe is the only realistic answer to this question; there are just too many variables to determine whether or not it is a reasonable goal for you.

Shane

Edited by gsmacleod 2012-11-02 7:57 AM
2012-11-02 8:08 AM
in reply to: #4480078

User image

Elite
3515
20001000500
Romeoville, Il
Subject: RE: Run improvement - is this a reasonable goal
I think 1:40 is pretty realistic.  However, I think you could lose more than 10-15lbs by spring if you want to.  You may get closer to that 1:30 if you did.  1:30 is a tough number though.  I think you'll find it easier to go from 2:00 to 1:40 than 1:40 to 1:30.
2012-11-02 8:14 AM
in reply to: #4480086

User image

Master
2725
200050010010025
Washington, DC Metro
Subject: RE: Run improvement - is this a reasonable goal

gsmacleod - 2012-11-02 8:57 AM
TrBeau17 - 2012-11-02 9:53 AM Question is that I would like to be about to run a half marathon by next June in about 1:30-1:40, is this a reasonable expectation/goal?
Maybe is the only realistic answer to this question; there are just too many variables to determine whether or not it is a reasonable goal for you. Shane

I agree completely with the "maybe" answer, as there are just way too many variables.  However, IN GENERAL, given the details you provided I would say that it does not sound totally unreasonable.

You're young (28-ish I guess... based on HS 10 years ago).

You have some weight to lose (less weight = more speed)

You have 8 months to dedicate to training (a long time for a HM)

You are new to running (great improvements come quickly at the beginning)

All that said I would say that you have a good chance of meeting your goal.  I might think that 1:30 is a stretch, 1:40-ish should be fairly do-able though.

2012-11-02 9:16 AM
in reply to: #4480078

User image

Runner
Subject: RE: Run improvement - is this a reasonable goal
Personally, I think you're putting the cart before the horse. I think that trying to set an arbitrary time goal for a race that is several months away is not really all that useful, and in some instances can be downright detrimental.

A time goal for a specific race (or within a certain time frame) should be based on what you feel is achievable come race day, and that decision will be influenced by your training leading up to it, how you feel on race day, the course, the conditions, etc.

Having a long-term goal of wanting to run a 1:30 half marathon is fine, even helpful for some people; it can provide motivation, and yardstick against which to measure your overall training progress. But tying that goal to a specific event tends to lead to training for the time, and not necessarily for improved performance.

In short, I believe that it's better to let the times come to you, rather than trying to chase them. With experience, you can start to set short-term goals that are based on time, but trying to set a goal far in the future can be troublesome.
2012-11-02 9:22 AM
in reply to: #4480234


106
100
Subject: RE: Run improvement - is this a reasonable goal

 "In short, I believe that it's better to let the times come to you, rather than trying to chase them. With experience, you can start to set short-term goals that are based on time, but trying to set a goal far in the future can be troublesome.

"

 

IN REPLY

To clarify is exactly what I'm trying to do.  BarryPs plan, which is talked about alot on this forum, does exactly that, lets your times come to you.  My question was basically by using that approach have others seen improvements in that ballpark?



Edited by TrBeau17 2012-11-02 9:22 AM


2012-11-02 9:31 AM
in reply to: #4480078

User image

Pro
5169
50001002525
Burbs
Subject: RE: Run improvement - is this a reasonable goal

That's a drop from a 9:20 mm to a 6:50 mm. That's a LOT.

2012-11-02 9:36 AM
in reply to: #4480078

User image

Master
3888
20001000500100100100252525
Overland Park, KS
Subject: RE: Run improvement - is this a reasonable goal
A 1:40 HM is about a 7:40 min/mile pace for which is you put in the miles (consistent training), stay injury free and shed a few pounds is very achieveable in my opinion.  The 1:30 is another story and that is likely to take a few years to accomplish but hey, if you can hit that 1;40 pace by June,who knows...
2012-11-02 9:55 AM
in reply to: #4480078

User image

Expert
1091
1000252525
St. Paul, MN
Subject: RE: Run improvement - is this a reasonable goal
I agree with parts of what EVERYONE has said.

- 1:40 could be reachable.

- But there are a LOT of variables.

- And it would probably be best to not think of possible times right now for next years race. Just take training week-by-week and see what happens during your 13.1 next year. (This is coming from someone who's QUITE goal orientated, and it's caused me to get injured or to "crash and burn" in the past.)

So I say "just train right now," and worry about the finishing time when you're about to cross the finish line. You'll learn so much from that first race, and you'll know how to make the next one faster yet.

Good luck!
2012-11-02 10:31 AM
in reply to: #4480078

User image

Extreme Veteran
2261
20001001002525
Ridgeland, Mississippi
Subject: RE: Run improvement - is this a reasonable goal

Yes it's very reasonable.

2012-11-02 10:36 AM
in reply to: #4480078

User image

Expert
1375
1000100100100252525
McAllen
Subject: RE: Run improvement - is this a reasonable goal
Just shoot for breaking 1:15 as hard as possible that way no matter what you achieve race day you'll wanna push harder thats me though. Some people don't like my strategy very much though. I feel it maximizes my training leading up to race day.


Edited by odpaul7 2012-11-02 10:36 AM


2012-11-02 10:45 AM
in reply to: #4480078

User image

Member
109
100
Subject: RE: Run improvement - is this a reasonable goal

where do you live?  June in some parts of the country (like where I live in TX), the weather does not lend itself to running "fast" halfs like you could in the winter.

That said, if you've never done a 13.1, realistically I wouldn't set too ambitious of time goals.  Just go out and try to feel good for the first 9-10 miles, because that's when the race really starts.  Go as hard as you can the last 5k.  Once you get pacing down you can pretty evenly split the entire race, but it will take some experience racing to do so.

2012-11-02 11:02 AM
in reply to: #4480268

User image

Master
2725
200050010010025
Washington, DC Metro
Subject: RE: Run improvement - is this a reasonable goal
trishie - 2012-11-02 10:31 AM

That's a drop from a 9:20 mm to a 6:50 mm. That's a LOT.

I just giggled reading your post... then your sig block!  Wink

2012-11-02 11:05 AM
in reply to: #4480251

User image

Champion
5312
5000100100100
Calgary
Subject: RE: Run improvement - is this a reasonable goal
TrBeau17 - 2012-11-02 8:22 AM


 "In short, I believe that it's better to let the times come to you, rather than trying to chase them. With experience, you can start to set short-term goals that are based on time, but trying to set a goal far in the future can be troublesome.

"

 

IN REPLY

To clarify is exactly what I'm trying to do.  BarryPs plan, which is talked about alot on this forum, does exactly that, lets your times come to you.  My question was basically by using that approach have others seen improvements in that ballpark?



I went from a 2:18 to a 1:46 following a run lots mostly easy rarely hard type of approach. For the first 2 years all I did was run easy. My mileage went from....15 miles a week to 60 miles a week over this time. I also went from maybe 220-230 to 180. For what it is worth, adding a mile a week is a bit conservative if you are running easy all the time. I mean it isn't too conservative, because with running and being a big guy you can't be too conservative. You might be able to get away with adding more, like 5k a week until you get to maybe 60k a week. After that you may find adding miles starts to come more difficult and moving to 1 mile a week may make more sense. But that is all assuming you are running easy. If you even throw in one hard workout the stress that does on your body when you are just starting is a really risk, and keep in mind that going long is a moderatly hard workout.

For me, 1:46 was pretty fast. To go to 1:40, I mean, that would be a big leap for me. And 1:30, I mean, those guys are in good shape and I don't see many of them looking like they are carrying any extra weight.

Anyway, guess my story isn't very on point.

Good luck.



Edited by BigDH 2012-11-02 11:05 AM
2012-11-02 11:08 AM
in reply to: #4480078

User image

Extreme Veteran
556
5002525
Subject: RE: Run improvement - is this a reasonable goal

While I respect your admirable goal, I don't think it's realistic, even with losing another 10-15 lbs.  It's just too short a time and you are starting out with 9:20 min/mile (maybe adjust to 9:00 min/mile on a non-hilly, flatter course).  Going to roughly 7:54 min/mile for 13.1 miles to hit 1:40 at the high end of your goal is a lofty expectation.  

That being said, if you do get it done, 1:40 is more realistic than 1:30.



Edited by mattramirez 2012-11-02 11:10 AM
2012-11-02 11:25 AM
in reply to: #4480407


106
100
Subject: RE: Run improvement - is this a reasonable goal
I live in Minnesota, so June isn't too hot.  I did a 13.1 mile but it was training and not an actual race.


2012-11-02 11:45 AM
in reply to: #4480513

Master
10208
50005000100100
Northern IL
Subject: RE: Run improvement - is this a reasonable goal

TrBeau17 - 2012-11-02 11:25 AM I live in Minnesota, so June isn't too hot.  I did a 13.1 mile but it was training and not an actual race.

With this I'm not sure the cart isn't still before the horse (as Scout said). It's fine if you want to ask to see what's possible, but this seems to still hint at defending a goal. You shouldn't be looking at a goal time for this race until well into spring time (given it's a June race). Then you'll have a lot more training in and see how you've been progressing.

2012-11-02 12:01 PM
in reply to: #4480078

User image

Master
1460
10001001001001002525
Burlington, Vermont
Subject: RE: Run improvement - is this a reasonable goal

It's already been stated, but your goal is misdirected. Given that, a 1:30 is not a reasonable goal here and you set yourself up for frustration and, likely, injury by trying to hit it. Just asking the question that casually tosses out 1:30 and 1:40 in the same framework indicates a lack of necessary understanding for what those two time marks feel like. Those are two very different races.

Big jumps are not at all uncommon for new racers. Jumping from 2:00 to 1:45 will not be at all unheard of. Sub 1:40 could also happen on a magic day where it all comes together. This assumes consistent run training between now and the race (I'd build to feel comfortable at 35 miles per week at minimum ... preferably closer to 45).

Dropping from 1:40 to 1:30 is going to take a lot more run-focussed work than dropping to 1:45 will.

Add me to the group that encourages more miles run well within your comfortable heart rate zones. Don't "test" yourself by trying to run your routes faster each week. Just run. A lot.

 

2012-11-02 12:21 PM
in reply to: #4480078


62
2525
Subject: RE: Run improvement - is this a reasonable goal

This is a very unscientific comment, I did not really try to think about your goals and whether they are reasonable or not, but I found this quote quite inspirational I once read somewhere

 “When it is obvious that the goals cannot be reached, don’t adjust the goals, adjust the action steps.” – Confucius

2012-11-02 12:44 PM
in reply to: #4480461

User image

Extreme Veteran
845
50010010010025
Subject: RE: Run improvement - is this a reasonable goal
Sous - 2012-11-02 11:02 AM
trishie - 2012-11-02 10:31 AM

That's a drop from a 9:20 mm to a 6:50 mm. That's a LOT.

I just giggled reading your post... then your sig block!  Wink

I got a kick out of that as well.  Only one thing to add: In addition to running lots/mostly easy/sometimes hard, I think you'll need to start getting serious about speed sessions once a week.

2012-11-02 12:50 PM
in reply to: #4480234

User image

Veteran
232
10010025
Charlotte
Gold member
Subject: RE: Run improvement - is this a reasonable goal

Scout7 - 2012-11-02 10:16 AM

Scout:  Welcome back!  I haven't noticed a post from you in months.



2012-11-02 6:21 PM
in reply to: #4480479

User image

Member
109
100
Subject: RE: Run improvement - is this a reasonable goal
mattramirez - 2012-11-02 11:08 AM

 Going to roughly 7:54 min/mile for 13.1 miles to hit 1:40 at the high end of your goal is a lofty expectation.  

fyi 1:40 is actually 7:38 miles.  I just happened to know since I did 1:43:30 at my last race and that is around 7:54 miles.

going from 2:00 to 1:45 would be something more reasonable for OP imo, anything better would be gravy but trying to go under 1:40 might be a setup for injury/failure.

2012-11-02 7:59 PM
in reply to: #4480078

User image

Elite
5313
5000100100100
Alturas, California
Subject: RE: Run improvement - is this a reasonable goal
1:30 is really quite a bit faster than it would be reasonable for you to improve to from where you are at unless your dady was an olympian or your mama won at Boston.  Dropping 36 minutes off a marathon is pretty significant, but dripping 36 minutes off a half marathon is massive.  Going from low 9:00s to mid 7:00s takes most folks a couple years running 1200 to 1500 miles a year.  Going from mid 7s to high 6s at a hm distance is probably another couple years.  Yes if you are genetically gifted you could go to 1:25:00 in 2 months, but that is your 1 in 10,000,000 kind of genetics, not something that any of us can say you have with no information about your heritage.  So you are at 2:06... 1:45 is a reasonable goal, 1:40 would be pushing it and 1:30 um no... unless you have more information that lets us you know have some quality geenes in there. 
2012-11-02 8:09 PM
in reply to: #4481588


106
100
Subject: RE: Run improvement - is this a reasonable goal

Nope no freak genetics in play, but I should mention that the 2:06 was my 1st time even running a half marathon distance.  Prior to that training run my longest runs were 10 and 11 miles, which were each done once in the weeks leading up to the race. 

New Thread
General Discussion Triathlon Talk » Run improvement - is this a reasonable goal Rss Feed