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2016-02-18 12:52 AM

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Subject: Coaches - What's your philosophy?
To the coaches out there, what's your coaching philosophy?? This is an area I've always struggled with defining. I'm sure I have a philosophy, but I'll be darned if I can articulate it.

it seems like all the big name coaches with books and big programs have some kind of a hook or branded pyramid of values or "4 pillars" or whatever.
I think it's OK for every coach to have a different philosophy and there is no right one...we all have different backgrounds. However it's like having an elevator speech...if you're in Vegas at a Triathlon conference and the athlete of your dreams happens to be riding in elevator with you and asks, "What's your coaching philosophy?" What would you say?

Some of these ideas have resonated with me in the recent past:
1) Endurance Training / Training Plan design / periodization plan
2) Nutrition - Daily, Fueling for training, recovery nutrition
3) Strength & Conditioning - I struggle with this one since everyone has varied backgrounds (but that's the case for the other areas too, right?
4) Recovery / Quality of Training - are you rested for the training sessions scheduled in the first item?

Where does "teaching" fit in? Race tactics? Empowering the athlete? Athlete autonomy? Those are all important to me. Maybe I put those into my main pillars as well?

I"m not asking what is coaching about, I know we can write pages and pages of threads on that. But...if you can articulate it, what's YOUR coaching philosophy? Athletes who are not coaches feel free to respond as well with what's your SELF coaching philosophy?


2016-02-18 4:25 AM
in reply to: AdventureBear

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Subject: RE: Coaches - What's your philosophy?

Originally posted by AdventureBear
what's your SELF coaching philosophy?


I am self coached

- train hard but smart
- understand what you are trying to accomplish and how the training will get you there.
- learn who to take advice from

- time is the one thing you can't buy. Use it wisely
2016-02-18 5:55 AM
in reply to: AdventureBear

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Subject: RE: Coaches - What's your philosophy?
Not a formally trained coach, but I'm a teacher, and work with elementary kids in track, cross-country, and, in the past, swimming. I'm also an athlete who has variously been coached, self-coached, and just run recreationally without any training plan. I've had coaches who brought me places I never envisioned going, and ones who failed me dismally in both a fitness and emotional sense. One of my coaches helped me become one of the top 50 distance runners (for marathon and half) in the US while still a teenager, and thoroughly enjoy the process; another destroyed my confidence to the point where I quite competitive running altogether when I was barely 20. I've recently started working with a coach again after going nowhere near one for over two decades.

What scares me the most in both teaching and coaching are those who have a canned philosophy or rigid approach and believe that is always right for every student or athlete. If I saw some kind of pyramids or pillars or brands on a coach's website, I would probably close the window. Likewise, any speaker who claimed that some new approach is the panacea for all learners has lost me. People, kids and adults, are just so different, physically and emotionally, that I just can't imagine how any canned, rigid approach could work for everyone, student or athlete, child or adult.

It's a matter of understanding basic principles of learning, physiology, psychology, etc., taking the time to understand the individual, and adapting the approach to the athlete's strengths, weaknesses, needs, goals, personality, and life situation. The principles are the science, the adaptation of those to the individual is the art. The best coaches I've had were masters of both. The worst were those who had a decent base in the science (or thought they did) but were convinced that one particular approach was the gospel, and applied it indiscriminately to all their athletes, then when someone failed to make the expected progress, blamed it on the athlete's lack of innate ability or effort, rather than taking a hard look at what was and wasn't working and why and trying to address that.
2016-02-18 8:05 AM
in reply to: AdventureBear

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Subject: RE: Coaches - What's your philosophy?

While I'm not any kind of certified coach, I did help coach a kids triathlon team over a couple years (and left over issues with the head coach that only peripherally involved coaching practices). Most coaches are all into the numbers -- power, splits, etc. My approach was completely different. While I did track workouts with them, and kept track of splits, I didn't tell them what their splits were at the practice, only a qualitative broad-brush.

I told them up front I was not a numbers guy, because when the starting gun goes off, races are won or lost in the heart and in the head, and that is where I concentrated my coaching -- getting them mentally and emotionally ready to race. They were racing super-sprints, so any hesitation, any moment of self-doubt could be the deciding factor. We had several kids that went to nationals. I'd like to think that I helped that happen in some small way.

2016-02-18 8:46 AM
in reply to: AdventureBear

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Subject: RE: Coaches - What's your philosophy?

Originally posted by AdventureBear

 . . . you're in Vegas at a Triathlon conference and the athlete of your dreams happens to be riding in elevator with you and asks, "What's your coaching philosophy?" What would you say? 

I would say that I don't have a pre-defined coaching philosophy because each athlete is an individual.  Which probably best describes my coaching philosophy.

There are prerequisites that any coach must meet in order to truly be considered a coach - knowledge of physiology, psychology, nutrition, etc.  In order to apply that knowledge in the context of a coaching relationship, a coach must be a communicator, an educator, a motivator, a consoler, a planner, and a leader - to name a couple of required skills.  Athletic experience is helpful to provide common ground and an understanding of what long term training and competition actually feels like.  However, I realized some time ago that NONE of those things will make for a good coach.  Any coach can write a "X" week triathlon training plan and any athlete can take that plan, follow it, and likely complete the race for which they trained.  Will that athlete have achieved their maximum potential following that generic pre-written plan?  Most likely not.

For me. coaching comes down to just a few guiding principles:

  • Each athlete is an individual
  • Training is useless if the athlete is sick or injured
  • Listen to the athlete and what the athlete's training is telling you
  • The athlete and the coach must be in agreement on goals

Weighing each coaching decision against those principles allows me to focus my knowledge, skills and experience into the art of coaching.  I sometimes don't know what workout the athletes I work with are going to be doing tomorrow, let alone next week - because I don't follow a pre-written plan.  Sure, we have an outline with loosely written workouts.  We know on this day there will be a swim and a run, or on that day there will be a ride, a strength session, and a run.  But what tomorrow's workout might consist of will largely be determined by the results of today's workout, or the sum total of this week's workouts.  There are far too many unhealthy, very fit athletes who are one illness or injury away from the end of their athletic career.  Knowing each athlete as an individual, understanding their life situation and the stressors that may bring, recognizing their strengths and weaknesses, and closely following workout data works together to customize a plan that works best for THAT athlete and brings them to the starting line, fully prepared, healthy, and focused on achieving excellence.

So, I don't really have an all encompassing coaching philosophy other than to say that each athlete is an individual.

2016-02-18 8:48 AM
in reply to: AdventureBear

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Subject: RE: Coaches - What's your philosophy?

Are you trying to put together an elevator pitch or value prop for lack of a better term?  Something to demonstrate your particular skill set in coaching?



2016-02-18 9:13 AM
in reply to: #5167776

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Subject: RE: Coaches - What's your philosophy?
I luckily got to do a running group with an awesome running coach last summer. He kept repeating to us "you have no chance of winning if you can't get to the starting line". He said too many people screw up their chances by getting hurt before the race. It sounds like common sense- but it's one of those nuggets that is now stuck in my head. Like my USS coach's If you're cold it means you're not swimming fast enough. And an ex-ceo's you can be cold, tired, hungry and miserable or you can just be cold, tired and hungry.

It's funny what sticks with you over decades.

Do you have any personal isms you use? Maybe that will help jump start your message. What do you say to an athlete that's struggling?
2016-02-18 9:43 AM
in reply to: Hot Runner

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Subject: RE: Coaches - What's your philosophy?
Originally posted by Hot Runner

What scares me the most in both teaching and coaching are those who have a canned philosophy or rigid approach and believe that is always right for every student or athlete. If I saw some kind of pyramids or pillars or brands on a coach's website, I would probably close the window. Likewise, any speaker who claimed that some new approach is the panacea for all learners has lost me. People, kids and adults, are just so different, physically and emotionally, that I just can't imagine how any canned, rigid approach could work for everyone, student or athlete, child or adult.



I don't coach and haven't used a coach, but in business I have seen a lot of people with this approach. It works for them because they target that kind of client whose needs matches their methods. They can be very successful because they have a very well defined target. But in business there is a problem with this: When their client's needs change then the system becomes broken for that client. I would assume that the same thing happens for coaches and their clients, and I suspect that when you see that pro athletes changed coaches that often part of the reason is that the system stopped working for them.
2016-02-18 10:15 AM
in reply to: bwingate

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Subject: RE: Coaches - What's your philosophy?

Since coaching is Adventure Bears business we can break it down into the sales side of the model.  Referring to what the previous posters commented a business coach would most likely tell her she needs to find her niche or target market to be successful on the prospecting side.  The elevator pitch needs to be specific and short but deliver the message of what sets her apart from other coaches.  If she says I work with any athlete and my clients represent a wide range of performances most business coaches would say, yawn you no different from anyone else.  If she says my coaching philosophy is X and my approach is Y then it could seem she pigeon holes all her athletes into the same model.   IMO someone in Adventure Bears position should have two or three of these pitches in her bag.  One geared toward FOP / pro athletes,  one geared toward the MOP gang and one geared toward swimming (TI).  I'm taking a guess here based off your posts I have read.   The key for AB to have a good open ended question to ask these people in order to figure out what segment she is speaking with.  She should have the hook to get them interested in her and then she can explain why her philosophy or model can work for that specific athlete.  That could be part of a later discovery conversation with the prospect which gives her more insight into what that particular persons needs and goals are. 

Not an expert but I have worked with a few business coaches over the years.

 

2016-02-18 11:46 AM
in reply to: Goggles Pizzano

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Subject: RE: Coaches - What's your philosophy?
Originally posted by Goggles Pizzano

 The key for AB to have a good open ended question to ask these people in order to figure out what segment she is speaking with.  She should have the hook to get them interested in her and then she can explain why her philosophy or model can work for that specific athlete.  That could be part of a later discovery conversation with the prospect which gives her more insight into what that particular persons needs and goals are. 

Not an expert but I have worked with a few business coaches over the years.

 




This is interesting and i think you've nailed my dilemma. It seems like every CEU i've done whether business or coaching related (ie business of coaching, or just coaching) talks about philosophy, ideal athlete, etc. I feel like there is an expected right or wrong way to approach things, but I know there can't be.

I LOVE TEACHING beginners skills b/c I'm good at it and love to see them progress & gain confidence...but those aren't going to be the fast athletes right away.

I LOVE DATA and getting an athlete that reports all the data is rare, but I don't have time/energy to have every athlete be a data nered

I LOVE ELITE PERFORMERS because they listen and they respond and fast is simply fun!

But all three of these are not mutually overlapping. In fact Kirsten (who is in my signature line), has trained entirely by RPE on the bike. This year is the first we've looked at power numbers b/c she only JUST got a power meter. It's impossible for me to state a philosophy of "I love working with data" because I'd have completely missed the opportunity to work with one of the best amateur triathletes, and possibly the highest performing one I'll ever work with.

So I'm curious to hear others "philosophies" to learn if I'm missing something in how I describe what I do or who I like to work with.

In the ER I see every one who walks through the door, because I LIKE the variety. I didn't become a geriatrician or a pediatrician or sports medicine doctor or a family practice doctor...yet i get to play a bit of each of those in the ER. Coaching is similar for me. Thanks for the feedback.
2016-02-18 1:12 PM
in reply to: AdventureBear

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Subject: RE: Coaches - What's your philosophy?
Originally posted by AdventureBear

I LOVE DATA and getting an athlete that reports all the data is rare, but I don't have time/energy to have every athlete be a data nered

But all three of these are not mutually overlapping. In fact Kirsten (who is in my signature line), has trained entirely by RPE on the bike. This year is the first we've looked at power numbers b/c she only JUST got a power meter. It's impossible for me to state a philosophy of "I love working with data" because I'd have completely missed the opportunity to work with one of the best amateur triathletes, and possibly the highest performing one I'll ever work with.



For me this is simple

If an athlete likes the results of the data, it's the coaches job to present it in a way it can be understood by the athlete. Think executive dashboard.
If an athlete wants to dive in and better understand the underlying components of the data, it's the coaches job to explain it. Think of dashboard with drill through to detail.
If the athlete hates data, convince him/her all they have to do is press start on stop on the watch and upload it now and then. Think "big thumbs up" icon :-)

A friend of mine has worn a Garmin on every workout for a year. He never looked at a chart. He knows how to upload to Garmin Connect and he is pretty religious about making sure it's there. The other day he said he thought he wasn't doing well. I showed him his PMC, his MMP chart and it showed a) he had improved b) we was in better shape then ever. I explained it for 10min and he was content.

He said "Cool, you'll have to show me how that works one day", but he went home feeling good about his training.

The athlete doesn't need the data to get his part done. It makes the coaches life much more efficient to have the data.
Collecting it has become stupid simple and the key to remote coaching.



2016-02-18 1:56 PM
in reply to: marcag

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Subject: RE: Coaches - What's your philosophy?
Originally posted by marcag

Originally posted by AdventureBear

I LOVE DATA and getting an athlete that reports all the data is rare, but I don't have time/energy to have every athlete be a data nered

But all three of these are not mutually overlapping. In fact Kirsten (who is in my signature line), has trained entirely by RPE on the bike. This year is the first we've looked at power numbers b/c she only JUST got a power meter. It's impossible for me to state a philosophy of "I love working with data" because I'd have completely missed the opportunity to work with one of the best amateur triathletes, and possibly the highest performing one I'll ever work with.



For me this is simple

If an athlete likes the results of the data, it's the coaches job to present it in a way it can be understood by the athlete. Think executive dashboard.
If an athlete wants to dive in and better understand the underlying components of the data, it's the coaches job to explain it. Think of dashboard with drill through to detail.
If the athlete hates data, convince him/her all they have to do is press start on stop on the watch and upload it now and then. Think "big thumbs up" icon :-)

A friend of mine has worn a Garmin on every workout for a year. He never looked at a chart. He knows how to upload to Garmin Connect and he is pretty religious about making sure it's there. The other day he said he thought he wasn't doing well. I showed him his PMC, his MMP chart and it showed a) he had improved b) we was in better shape then ever. I explained it for 10min and he was content.

He said "Cool, you'll have to show me how that works one day", but he went home feeling good about his training.

The athlete doesn't need the data to get his part done. It makes the coaches life much more efficient to have the data.
Collecting it has become stupid simple and the key to remote coaching.




What's PMC and MMP? (a tangent I know, but if it's a metric...I'm drooling)
2016-02-18 2:02 PM
in reply to: 0

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Subject: RE: Coaches - What's your philosophy?
Originally posted by 3mar

Originally posted by marcag

Originally posted by AdventureBear

I LOVE DATA and getting an athlete that reports all the data is rare, but I don't have time/energy to have every athlete be a data nered

But all three of these are not mutually overlapping. In fact Kirsten (who is in my signature line), has trained entirely by RPE on the bike. This year is the first we've looked at power numbers b/c she only JUST got a power meter. It's impossible for me to state a philosophy of "I love working with data" because I'd have completely missed the opportunity to work with one of the best amateur triathletes, and possibly the highest performing one I'll ever work with.



For me this is simple

If an athlete likes the results of the data, it's the coaches job to present it in a way it can be understood by the athlete. Think executive dashboard.
If an athlete wants to dive in and better understand the underlying components of the data, it's the coaches job to explain it. Think of dashboard with drill through to detail.
If the athlete hates data, convince him/her all they have to do is press start on stop on the watch and upload it now and then. Think "big thumbs up" icon :-)

A friend of mine has worn a Garmin on every workout for a year. He never looked at a chart. He knows how to upload to Garmin Connect and he is pretty religious about making sure it's there. The other day he said he thought he wasn't doing well. I showed him his PMC, his MMP chart and it showed a) he had improved b) we was in better shape then ever. I explained it for 10min and he was content.

He said "Cool, you'll have to show me how that works one day", but he went home feeling good about his training.

The athlete doesn't need the data to get his part done. It makes the coaches life much more efficient to have the data.
Collecting it has become stupid simple and the key to remote coaching.




What's PMC and MMP? (a tangent I know, but if it's a metric...I'm drooling)


Your coach should be there to educate you :-)
Just kidding

PMC : Performance management chart, shows your fitness, fatigue, load......
MMP : Mean maximal power, the power you sustained over various durations from 1s to many hours. You can compare periods of times ie last year vs this year

Edited by marcag 2016-02-18 2:03 PM
2016-02-18 2:51 PM
in reply to: marcag

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Subject: RE: Coaches - What's your philosophy?
Originally posted by marcag

Originally posted by 3mar

Originally posted by marcag

Originally posted by AdventureBear

I LOVE DATA and getting an athlete that reports all the data is rare, but I don't have time/energy to have every athlete be a data nered

But all three of these are not mutually overlapping. In fact Kirsten (who is in my signature line), has trained entirely by RPE on the bike. This year is the first we've looked at power numbers b/c she only JUST got a power meter. It's impossible for me to state a philosophy of "I love working with data" because I'd have completely missed the opportunity to work with one of the best amateur triathletes, and possibly the highest performing one I'll ever work with.



For me this is simple

If an athlete likes the results of the data, it's the coaches job to present it in a way it can be understood by the athlete. Think executive dashboard.
If an athlete wants to dive in and better understand the underlying components of the data, it's the coaches job to explain it. Think of dashboard with drill through to detail.
If the athlete hates data, convince him/her all they have to do is press start on stop on the watch and upload it now and then. Think "big thumbs up" icon :-)

A friend of mine has worn a Garmin on every workout for a year. He never looked at a chart. He knows how to upload to Garmin Connect and he is pretty religious about making sure it's there. The other day he said he thought he wasn't doing well. I showed him his PMC, his MMP chart and it showed a) he had improved b) we was in better shape then ever. I explained it for 10min and he was content.

He said "Cool, you'll have to show me how that works one day", but he went home feeling good about his training.

The athlete doesn't need the data to get his part done. It makes the coaches life much more efficient to have the data.
Collecting it has become stupid simple and the key to remote coaching.




What's PMC and MMP? (a tangent I know, but if it's a metric...I'm drooling)


Your coach should be there to educate you :-)
Just kidding

PMC : Performance management chart, shows your fitness, fatigue, load......
MMP : Mean maximal power, the power you sustained over various durations from 1s to many hours. You can compare periods of times ie last year vs this year


Who needs a coach when you have BT?

Are those available on Garmin connect? I couldn't find them.

I actually did a DIY version of the MMP the other day. I went through all my trainer workouts over 1 hour and compared my max 60 minute power (I didn't include long rides outdoors). I was going to look at max 20 minute power but it was skewed due to FTP tests throughout, but the 60 minute power took that out. I figured since I stuck to all the numbers on the winter training program that would go up and it did. Now I know what to call it.
2016-02-18 2:57 PM
in reply to: 3mar

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Subject: RE: Coaches - What's your philosophy?
Originally posted by 3mar

Who needs a coach when you have BT?



We are sidetracking Suzanne's thread
2016-02-18 10:41 PM
in reply to: marcag

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Subject: RE: Coaches - What's your philosophy?
Originally posted by marcag

Originally posted by 3mar

Who needs a coach when you have BT?



We are sidetracking Suzanne's thread


I don't mind data sidetracks...


2016-02-18 10:42 PM
in reply to: 3mar

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Subject: RE: Coaches - What's your philosophy?
Originally posted by 3mar

Originally posted by marcag

Originally posted by 3mar

Originally posted by marcag

Originally posted by AdventureBear

I LOVE DATA and getting an athlete that reports all the data is rare, but I don't have time/energy to have every athlete be a data nered

But all three of these are not mutually overlapping. In fact Kirsten (who is in my signature line), has trained entirely by RPE on the bike. This year is the first we've looked at power numbers b/c she only JUST got a power meter. It's impossible for me to state a philosophy of "I love working with data" because I'd have completely missed the opportunity to work with one of the best amateur triathletes, and possibly the highest performing one I'll ever work with.



For me this is simple

If an athlete likes the results of the data, it's the coaches job to present it in a way it can be understood by the athlete. Think executive dashboard.
If an athlete wants to dive in and better understand the underlying components of the data, it's the coaches job to explain it. Think of dashboard with drill through to detail.
If the athlete hates data, convince him/her all they have to do is press start on stop on the watch and upload it now and then. Think "big thumbs up" icon :-)

A friend of mine has worn a Garmin on every workout for a year. He never looked at a chart. He knows how to upload to Garmin Connect and he is pretty religious about making sure it's there. The other day he said he thought he wasn't doing well. I showed him his PMC, his MMP chart and it showed a) he had improved b) we was in better shape then ever. I explained it for 10min and he was content.

He said "Cool, you'll have to show me how that works one day", but he went home feeling good about his training.

The athlete doesn't need the data to get his part done. It makes the coaches life much more efficient to have the data.
Collecting it has become stupid simple and the key to remote coaching.




What's PMC and MMP? (a tangent I know, but if it's a metric...I'm drooling)


Your coach should be there to educate you :-)
Just kidding

PMC : Performance management chart, shows your fitness, fatigue, load......
MMP : Mean maximal power, the power you sustained over various durations from 1s to many hours. You can compare periods of times ie last year vs this year


Who needs a coach when you have BT?

Are those available on Garmin connect? I couldn't find them.

I actually did a DIY version of the MMP the other day. I went through all my trainer workouts over 1 hour and compared my max 60 minute power (I didn't include long rides outdoors). I was going to look at max 20 minute power but it was skewed due to FTP tests throughout, but the 60 minute power took that out. I figured since I stuck to all the numbers on the winter training program that would go up and it did. Now I know what to call it.


Golden Cheeta, Training Peaks or WKO will all do this for you almost instantly.
2016-02-18 10:46 PM
in reply to: AdventureBear

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Subject: RE: Coaches - What's your philosophy?

Your best bet is to find good athletes.  It's what makes good coaches look like great coaches.

2016-02-18 11:00 PM
in reply to: Left Brain

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Subject: RE: Coaches - What's your philosophy?
Originally posted by Left Brain

Your best bet is to find good athletes.  It's what makes good coaches look like great coaches.




I know how that goes.
2016-02-18 11:16 PM
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Subject: RE: Coaches - What's your philosophy?

Originally posted by AdventureBear
Originally posted by Left Brain

Your best bet is to find good athletes.  It's what makes good coaches look like great coaches.

I know how that goes.

I know you know.....good coaches do. You can dress a pig in silk, as they say, but it's still a pig.  The greatest coaches in any sport have one thing in common besides their knowledge of their sport (which is actually quite common among coaches and non-coaches alike)......they have the ability to RECOGNIZE, recruit, and attract really good athletes....and recognition of talent is paramount.

If you really want to increase your resume......you have to find those freaks....otherwise, you will always be as common as your clients.  I don't mean that as mean spirited as it sounds, but the bottom line is very simple.....athletes of very high caliber are born.  A coach can bring it out and develop it......but you can NEVER create it....you simply have to find it.



Edited by Left Brain 2016-02-18 11:17 PM
2016-02-19 8:28 AM
in reply to: AdventureBear

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Subject: RE: Coaches - What's your philosophy?
Originally posted by AdventureBear

if you're in Vegas at a Triathlon conference and the athlete of your dreams happens to be riding in elevator with you and asks, "What's your coaching philosophy?" What would you say?



One thing I didn't see discussed, which is probably the most important thing is; what is your dream athlete? LB made the assumption it was the super uber elite...and that is probably a safe bet, but I didn't see you state that. Do you want to take the diamond in the rough and make the next Kona winner? Or do you want to take a competitive AGer and make them a KQ? For the 4 things you listed, I wouldn't imagine you would even mention them to these types. Those are givens for someone who has been in the sport enough to get competitive. I'd focus on bigger things that differentiate you from other coaches.

Now, if you derive the most satisfaction from turning someone who finishes an IM in 16:59 to someone who does it in 14:00, or getting someone off the couch and guiding them through the process and explaining what the heck your numbers 1-4 mean then that is a different elevator speech.

So the question is...what is your dream athlete?


2016-02-19 11:54 AM
in reply to: 3mar

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Tyler,
Subject: RE: Coaches - What's your philosophy?

Lots of good posts here.

A good coach, gets you ready to race on race day healthy and ready be your best and to know your body. He can also help weed out the useless data and training as there are lots marketed towards triathletes.  Although some is valuable, but if a coach is overly concerned with data and not the art of listening to the athlete and how they feel during the sessions, I would be concerned.  A good coach can explain something in a way that you get can it with only a few words. Concise and to the point. What is stopping most athletes is the stuff between the inability to "bear down".  Everyone is different so individual physiologic and personality characteristics must be considered. A primarily fast twitch person will need different training than a person with primarily slow twitch training for long course races.  Dealing with a super confident athlete is different than dealing with someone who is a afraid to do an open water swim.  There is NO one size fits all philosophy that a coach can come up with, there are some general principles of course. The coach must be adaptable to the athlete.  

 

 

2016-02-19 11:59 AM
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Subject: RE: Coaches - What's your philosophy?

Originally posted by triritter

Lots of good posts here.

A good coach, gets you ready to race on race day healthy and ready be your best and to know your body. He can also help weed out the useless data and training as there are lots marketed towards triathletes.  Although some is valuable, but if a coach is overly concerned with data and not the art of listening to the athlete and how they feel during the sessions, I would be concerned.  A good coach can explain something in a way that you get can it with only a few words. Concise and to the point. What is stopping most athletes is the stuff between the inability to "bear down".  Everyone is different so individual physiologic and personality characteristics must be considered. A primarily fast twitch person will need different training than a person with primarily slow twitch training for long course races.  Dealing with a super confident athlete is different than dealing with someone who is a afraid to do an open water swim.  There is NO one size fits all philosophy that a coach can come up with, there are some general principles of course. The coach must be adaptable to the athlete.  

 

Not always.......it depends on the athlete's stated goals.  Quite often the athlete needs to get with the program he said he wanted, or find another coach.  And sure, sometimes there needs to be a restructuring or "adaptation" once they know each other.  But I've seen plenty of athletes who don't actually DO the work that has been prescribed......and then blame a coach.



Edited by Left Brain 2016-02-19 12:01 PM
2016-02-19 12:19 PM
in reply to: Left Brain

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Tyler,
Subject: RE: Coaches - What's your philosophy?

Originally posted by Left Brain

Originally posted by triritter

Lots of good posts here.

A good coach, gets you ready to race on race day healthy and ready be your best and to know your body. He can also help weed out the useless data and training as there are lots marketed towards triathletes.  Although some is valuable, but if a coach is overly concerned with data and not the art of listening to the athlete and how they feel during the sessions, I would be concerned.  A good coach can explain something in a way that you get can it with only a few words. Concise and to the point. What is stopping most athletes is the stuff between the inability to "bear down".  Everyone is different so individual physiologic and personality characteristics must be considered. A primarily fast twitch person will need different training than a person with primarily slow twitch training for long course races.  Dealing with a super confident athlete is different than dealing with someone who is a afraid to do an open water swim.  There is NO one size fits all philosophy that a coach can come up with, there are some general principles of course. The coach must be adaptable to the athlete.  

 

Not always.......it depends on the athlete's stated goals.  Quite often the athlete needs to get with the program he said he wanted, or find another coach.  And sure, sometimes there needs to be a restructuring or "adaptation" once they know each other.  But I've seen plenty of athletes who don't actually DO the work that has been prescribed......and then blame a coach.

 

I agree with you there. Maybe a good coach and the athlete didn't listen and added more volume or a few more intervals gets hurt or simply didn't do the work and doesn't come close expectations.  Also, maybe just not a good coaching match. Not every coach-athlete relationship will work out. A coach can be stuck in their own way of thinking or the athlete simply isn't  ready to be coachable, so of course there is some more to it. 

2016-02-19 1:25 PM
in reply to: 3mar

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Subject: RE: Coaches - What's your philosophy?
Originally posted by 3mar

Originally posted by AdventureBear

if you're in Vegas at a Triathlon conference and the athlete of your dreams happens to be riding in elevator with you and asks, "What's your coaching philosophy?" What would you say?



One thing I didn't see discussed, which is probably the most important thing is; what is your dream athlete? LB made the assumption it was the super uber elite...and that is probably a safe bet, but I didn't see you state that. Do you want to take the diamond in the rough and make the next Kona winner? Or do you want to take a competitive AGer and make them a KQ? For the 4 things you listed, I wouldn't imagine you would even mention them to these types. Those are givens for someone who has been in the sport enough to get competitive. I'd focus on bigger things that differentiate you from other coaches.

Now, if you derive the most satisfaction from turning someone who finishes an IM in 16:59 to someone who does it in 14:00, or getting someone off the couch and guiding them through the process and explaining what the heck your numbers 1-4 mean then that is a different elevator speech.

So the question is...what is your dream athlete?



This is helpful. I've always had trouble identifying my ideal athlete, although the ones I've helped get to Kona are/were a lot of fun to coach, they respected my advice, followed the plan and provided data and feedback. other athletes...not so much. They are interested and want to improve (and do improve) but there's a big difference in my satisfaction working with the 16 hr to 14 hour athlete as opposed to the 11 hour to 9.5 hour type.
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