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Question on Training with Power Meter on Indoor Trainer
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| General Discussion | Triathlon Talk » Question on Training with Power Meter on Indoor Trainer | Rss Feed  |
 2016-03-02 9:58 PM |
 9 |  Subject: Question on Training with Power Meter on Indoor TrainerWhoever is answering, thank you for your time to read through my question/doubts. Over the weekdays I use my Tri bike with Stages power meter (Left crank arm only) on Kinetic Kurt trainer. When I observe my power numbers, I see that I can reach to my Z4/Z5 (FTP-230 W) with a cadence of 90+ on an easy to medium gear. But when I try to do strength workout, going into a big gear (smaller cog on the rear), my cadence definitely drops, and at the same time, it is really hard for me to get into Z4. I usually stay in low Z3, and my legs get tired too. Questions: 1) Am I doing something wrong in my strength workout ? How do others, like Pro's go into high Wattage at low cadence ? 2) If what I am doing is wrong, then how should I correct my workouts ? 3) Is there a right gear combination in which one should train for different workouts (over/unders, endurance / anaerobic / strength) ? 4) Should I forgo the power numbers, and look at the Cadence ? Appreciate your time. thanks !! |
| 2016-03-03 5:49 AM in reply to: sikhstride |
Elite 7783      PEI, Canada | Subject: RE: Question on Training with Power Meter on Indoor Trainer I struggle with hitting higher power numbers at lower cadence as well. You could also be running into one of the limitations of your Stages PM in that it is only measuring your left leg and doubling the number. My PM gives me a (pseudo) L/R power balance and at lower cadence I tend to be more right leg dominant while at a high cadence my left leg takes over. I've seen cases where a left only PM would read 20-30w high or low depending on what I was doing. |
| 2016-03-03 6:04 AM in reply to: sikhstride |
| 360 Ottawa, Ontario | Subject: RE: Question on Training with Power Meter on Indoor Trainer People have different strengths, and different cadence levels at which they are comfortable. Plenty of people seem most comfortable riding at like 85rpm, some people at like 95rpm. I just did two power tests this past weekend (20min FTP and 5min VO2Max) and both ended up having average cadences of 108rpm. Generally speaking lower cadences stress your muscles more, whereas higher cadences stress your cardiovascular system. It's beneficial to work both, just as its beneficial to be able to ride at different cadences comfortably. I don't think it's necessarily a problem that you're tiring quicker at lower cadences, it's just indicative of where our strengths/weakness are. Keep working at it and it'll improve. |
| 2016-03-03 6:24 AM in reply to: 0 |
Extreme Veteran 5722 | Subject: RE: Question on Training with Power Meter on Indoor Trainer Originally posted by sikhstride Whoever is answering, thank you for your time to read through my question/doubts. Over the weekdays I use my Tri bike with Stages power meter (Left crank arm only) on Kinetic Kurt trainer. When I observe my power numbers, I see that I can reach to my Z4/Z5 (FTP-230 W) with a cadence of 90+ on an easy to medium gear. But when I try to do strength workout, going into a big gear (smaller cog on the rear), my cadence definitely drops, and at the same time, it is really hard for me to get into Z4. I usually stay in low Z3, and my legs get tired too. Questions: 1) Am I doing something wrong in my strength workout ? How do others, like Pro's go into high Wattage at low cadence ? 2) If what I am doing is wrong, then how should I correct my workouts ? 3) Is there a right gear combination in which one should train for different workouts (over/unders, endurance / anaerobic / strength) ? 4) Should I forgo the power numbers, and look at the Cadence ? Appreciate your time. thanks !! All perfectly normal. Low cadence at Z4 is hard. Power is the result of how much force you are putting on the pedals AND how fast your spinning. So you can put more force at a lesser cadence OR less force at a faster cadence and generate the same amount of power. Depending on the force applied you are recruiting different muscle fibres. Some fibres are more resilient to fatigue some are more powerful. When you hit around Z4 your body knows how to find the right mix of muscle fibre and self selects a cadence so that the force applied is just right and using the right combination of muscle fibre. This is that whole conservation of cadence being self selected. If you drop cadence at a given power you need to increase force. If you do this at Z4 you are going into an area that your body doesn't necessarily like , is less fatige resilient and it's hard. This is normal and good. You are recruiting muscle you are trying to develop. If you are on a strength plan the power, cadence, duration and recovery of the intervals should be specified. Low cadence, low power will result in low force and not help so don't just go by cadence. You can do the equivalent of long moderate climbs at low cadence or very steep low cadence hill repeats at VO2 but the important element is being at a % of maximum torque/force. But this is your plan that should be specifying this. Edited by marcag 2016-03-03 6:26 AM |
| 2016-03-03 7:18 AM in reply to: marcag |
Extreme Veteran 5722 | Subject: RE: Question on Training with Power Meter on Indoor Trainer Some typos above I cannot correct. Sorry. It's "conversation" not "conservation". Oh well, I suspect you get the idea. |
| 2016-03-03 7:57 AM in reply to: sikhstride |
1502 Katy, Texas | Subject: RE: Question on Training with Power Meter on Indoor Trainer I seem to be the opposite. The higher the power, the lower the cadence. Since I have been doing trainer/PM workouts, my average cadence has dropped significantly. For intervals, I have a hard time meeting my power at anything over 70. I was worried about it at first, and tried to force a different cadence, but now I just go by feel and let nature take its course. |
| 2016-03-03 7:59 AM in reply to: sikhstride |
| Master 10208 Northern IL | Subject: RE: Question on Training with Power Meter on Indoor Trainer How low is your cadence for this? |
| 2016-03-03 8:19 AM in reply to: 3mar |
Extreme Veteran 1986 Cypress, TX | Subject: RE: Question on Training with Power Meter on Indoor Trainer Originally posted by 3mar I seem to be the opposite. The higher the power, the lower the cadence. Since I have been doing trainer/PM workouts, my average cadence has dropped significantly. For intervals, I have a hard time meeting my power at anything over 70. I was worried about it at first, and tried to force a different cadence, but now I just go by feel and let nature take its course. Same for me. Higher the power, lower the cadence when doing trainer workouts. |
| 2016-03-03 11:33 AM in reply to: sikhstride |
| 9 | Subject: RE: Question on Training with Power Meter on Indoor Trainer Is there a particular Gear combination that I should be picking when doing strength workout on the trainer ? I googled and came across the following article : http://britishcyclesport.com/2013/training/on-bike-strength-trainin... When training with Power Meter, and doing a strength workout, is one supposed to focus on power numbers, OR still look at cadence by dropping a gear or two. |
| 2016-03-03 1:25 PM in reply to: sikhstride |
| 1660 | Subject: RE: Question on Training with Power Meter on Indoor Trainer Originally posted by sikhstride Is there a particular Gear combination that I should be picking when doing strength workout on the trainer ? I googled and came across the following article : http://britishcyclesport.com/2013/training/on-bike-strength-trainin... When training with Power Meter, and doing a strength workout, is one supposed to focus on power numbers, OR still look at cadence by dropping a gear or two.
You're probably overthinking it for a triathlete cyclist, but in general, for 'strength' type activities you're focusing on building peak power over shorter intervals, and that calls for low cadence with heavy load and high power numbers as a result.
Note that while it's still important in triathlon cycling, leg cycling strength is less important in triathlon cycling compared to road cycling, since in road cycling, you have to cover breaks in the peloton or lose your draft, which means repeated high-power surges that you have to cover or get dropped. You don't have to do that in triathlon - in fact, you will generally ride better by avoiding surges as much as possible.
The simplest and error-free method of power-based training on the bike is to just forget about your cadence, and go by power alone. As long as your power numbers are improving, you will be faster. I wouldn't worry about cadence until you're at the point where you're nearly maxxing out all your gains with hard bike training, and need sharpening in specific areas. |
| 2016-03-03 2:13 PM in reply to: GMAN 19030 |
Extreme Veteran 2263 Ridgeland, Mississippi | Subject: RE: Question on Training with Power Meter on Indoor Trainer Originally posted by GMAN 19030 Originally posted by 3mar I seem to be the opposite. The higher the power, the lower the cadence. Since I have been doing trainer/PM workouts, my average cadence has dropped significantly. For intervals, I have a hard time meeting my power at anything over 70. I was worried about it at first, and tried to force a different cadence, but now I just go by feel and let nature take its course. Same for me. Higher the power, lower the cadence when doing trainer workouts. And I'm the opposite of that. I'm usually 90 RPM for threshold stuff, but for 1 min on/off type efforts I'm around 100-110 RPM. |
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