New Cyclist: Tri Bikes REALLY that unstable downhill?

Lies. First of all you won't be riding in a pack, there is no drafting (legally, anyway) in triathlons. Second, shame on both shops for trying to sell you two bikes when you only need one. Third, aero bikes are not much different from a stability standpoint than road bikes. The issue some riders have with aero bikes is that the brakes aren't located in the same place as the shifters\where your hands are usually at the end of the aero bars, so *if* there is a reason to brake quickly *in close quarters* they are dangerous to be around or on for other riders. But there's no peloton, no grouping. Aero bars are less nimble to steer with, but it's BS what you're being told. Doesn't matter if there are hills or not, a tri bike is faster, period. Watch the time trials in the Tour this week and count how many road bikes you see.

Tri bikes are designed to go fast for long periods of time. Otherwise, it's got two wheels, gears, brakes, a saddle, some pedals, and a frame, just like anything else. And by the way, train on what you will race on.

Edited by fisherman76 2013-07-15 1:18 PM

depends how comfortable you are on it. i hit 42mph going downhill in pouring rain this weekend with no problems and others will wreck riding on a flat straight road with no one around. as long as you spend time getting accustomed to riding it and the position you will be riding it i don't see a problem.

that being said, if i was going to only have one bike it would be a road bike.

Its true that TT bikes can be a little more twitchy and a little less forgiving than road bikes, especially on the aero bars -- maybe because your weight is further forward. But in the bullhorns, the differences in feel are minor.

If its a fast twisty descent, just stay out of the aero bars. On the bullhorns with good technique (and practice) a TT bike will be similar (but not quite as good) as a road bike. It seems to me that there's a lot of anti-TT bike sentiment from the road bike crowd.

Also, on a straight descent, a TT bike is significantly faster than a road bike.

typical type of response from a bike shop that doesn't have triathlon in their vocabulary.

their staff most likely comprises of "cyclists" which are not tri-aware nor tri-focused.

Find a shop that understands triathletes and triathlons, you will get a better response and advice IMO.

I have only riden my "tri" bike which is an old roadie with forward seat post (known to make a bike unstable becasue of weight shift) and aerobars. After years of riding with aerobars I can bunny hop the bike without even coming out of the aero position. Ride on my rollers in the aero position and infact am more comfortable riding aero then on the hoods. So it's, Tits I say!!! ( time in the saddle)

I wouldn't use the word unstable. in my opinion a tri bike that's properly fit is really stable. But each bike design has its ideal conditions.

If the road downhill is straight then in my opinion the tri bike is fine - awesome actually. But if the descent is curvy then I find a road bike to be easier to handle. Also I find climbing easier on a road bike.

Just a n = 1 experience to share. I had a road bike and had been riding for 2 years, tried to put on clip-ons, and then thought there was no way I would ever ride a tri bike because the road + clip-ons felt so twitchy and scary. Picked up a tri bike last month and I feel amazingly steady and secure riding in aero. I am truly shocked at the difference between the stability of the two bikes. I'll still probably be more cautious and come out of aero when I feel I could need my brakes and I think I need some practice with climbing in aero but I think my road bike might end up in the classifieds eventually.

I had zero bike experience and I went to both triathlon shops and the LBS and both recommended me to start with a road bike. So, I bought a road bike, and I'm very happy that I did:

- If you have zero experience even a road bike can be a challenge. A road bike has better handling: The hoods (or horns on the tri bike) are more stable than the aero bars and the drops are more stable than the hoods, in particular when going downhill.

- A road bike offers more riding positions, if you're new to riding, you'll like that. Soon enough you'll start getting used to longer rides and may transition to a tri bike. You'll have more fun riding a road bike to begin with.

- You can't shift from the horns to the aero bars fast enough on technical courses where you need to change gear and use the breaks frequently, the road bike wins hands down. Check that thread from last week regarding riding downhill on a tri bike.

- Applying the breaks hard you need to push agains the handles or you'll be thrown off. That is much easier in the drops than on the hoods or on the horns. Just this weekend I was riding down a steep descend on a new route, didn't know the turns or the quality of the road, looking out for potholes and turns was hard. I was very happy to have my drops with a good grip on the breaks and didn't make friends with the rocks.

- Not all races are drafting prohibited, in fact, races under ITU up to olympic distance are often drafting permitted (judging from BT, I have the impression that his is not so in US, or maybe people are just obsessed with IM/HIM?). A tri bike is prohibited in those races, they allow clip on aero bars with the restrictions that the aero bars must be closed (no pointing tubes) and must not extend beyond the hoods. With a road bike you can enter in all races, cycling, triathlon, drafting permitted or not.

- Some may not want you in their group rides for safety reasons if you come with a tri bike. The problem is that aero bars can be really dangerous in a crash - that's also why clip ons must be closed.

Really, the tri bike is a specialist bike. It's the undisputed champion on long flat routes with smooth curves. On technical routes with steep ascends and descends, hairpin turns etc. the road bike is better. Sure, an experienced rider can ride a tri bike fast on a technical course, but give hime a road bike and he'll likely ride even faster.

Edited by erik.norgaard 2013-07-15 4:53 PM

Thanks for all of the advice so far! That really helps set my mind at ease.

I think that quells my fears about downhill on the Aero bike. I was REALLY having a tough time understanding why anyone would ride one if they couldn't keep one upright on downhills, what they were saying just didn't add up. The math came out like this: Aero bikes are faster, but you can't go fast on an aero bike without tanking it. 2 + 2 = 3....

As far as needing a road bike for other races or for group rides, I guess I just don't see it being applicable for me right now. I consider myself a strength based athlete, but challenge myself to be well rounded. I don't foresee myself doing cycling races, nor do I see myself doing swims or road runs. The combination of skillsets and physical challenge of SBR is what allures me to triathlon, and hence, to get a tri bike. As far as group riding goes, maybe it's a mental thing I picked up in weight lifting, but I don't play well with others . If I go run or ride with someone, either they're faster than me, or I'm faster than them (in weight lifting, one can always lift more than the other), so if I'm riding in a group, either I'm holding the others back, or I'm getting held back. So I'm much more an independent trainer type. Everybody has their pace and distance they need to hit on a particular day, so I just don't relate to group rides. Maybe some people would say that makes me a , I don't know? Ultimately, it bugs me to think that someone is lagging their pace for me a lot more than it bugs me to wait on someone else, so I like to THINK I'm not just a .

Lack of control or hassle of switching back and forth between the bull horns and aero bars is pretty legit, and that's part of my interest in having two bikes.

So I think that pretty well cements me into an aero bike, assuming I can find one that really fits (no doubt). If my tastes change and I find myself needing a road bike, I wouldn't mind getting two bikes, or swapping bikes to suit that specific purpose later on. For now, I want to be sure I'm on the right bike for my application.

I have a Shiv that has been fitted to me and I love it. It is my primary bike. I have no standard road bike. The Shiv is amazing going down hill. It is so stable and it is a rocket. I have had it over 50 on really steep descents (not smart, but oh so fun) and other than the baseline terror of something dumb happening I have never felt twitchy or unstable. If it fits you, it is a great bike.

I may be buying a road bike (my first one, in my sixth year of tri training) just because I would like to do some more group rides but I have never felt like I am missing out on much by only having a tri bike.

I never do group rides (tried a couple, it wasn't my scene), but I agree with Jason that I'd go for a road bike before a tri bike, due to the versatility.

I like riding my TT bike in races, and I appreciate the speed. But for most of my training I'm happier on a roadie, and I ride more as a result. When I ride outside (which isn't often, as I'm mostly on the trainer), I am happy to ride in many more places on my roadie than on my TT bike. On (sub)urban streets and nearby areas the cars, the potholes, the steep ups or downs -- all of those are easier to handle on a roadie. And I can enjoy a 5, 6, ... 10 hour ride on the roadie which I couldn't imagine doing in aero position. I might struggle more in aero because of my eyesight - I have to peer out the top of my glasses, so I feel that I'm always seeing the road ahead less clearly. As for the time that I'm at home on the trainer: both bikes work, of course, but I just like the roadie more ... and it's easier to watch movies while sitting up.

If you're looking for a versatile road bike with tri-capabilities, then look an aero road bike, like the Specialized Venge or Cervelo S5, you could slap some low profile aero bars on the bars, and move the seat post forward for a more seat position.

A well-fitting tri bike is remarkably stable when up to speed (all tri bikes will be less stable and than a well-fitting road bike at very low speeds, that has to do with the front end geometry and weight distribution), but that's exactly the issue... many beginner triathletes don't get a well fitting bike (especially from LBS's that are really road bike stores and know very little about tri bikes...) and then yes, a tri bike can be a handful to control going downhill. BUT, that has really nothing to do with the bike itself, but rather that it doesn't fit YOU.

Last year when I purchased my bike I asked a bunch of questions to the community about the differences between the bikes. Here is the old thread.

http://www.beginnertriathlete.com/discussion/forums/thread-view.asp?tid=467799&page=1


Maybe you will find some useful information.

+1 to everything here, including the Shiv. Love it. When I go on group rides (which is rare), I stay off my aero bars unless the group is a group oftriathletes. No problem. Your goal is to train for tris, get a tri bike, a good fit, a trainer and sign up for Trainer Road.

You know you want to do triathlons, so get a tri bike. That's my $0.02.

My first bike was a P2. If it handles any differently, I'll never know. I don't do a lot of group rides, and when I do it's generally with other triathletes on tri bikes. There is no peloton. A well-made tri bike is designed to be comfortable and stable in an aero position over the distances you are planning to ride. The only issue I ever have with downhills is feeling a little funny getting my hands from the aerobars to the brakes at 35+ mph.

Your LBS is full of BS. They understand roadbikes and are trying to sell you what they know. like the old saying goeas: To some people with a hammer and every problem looks like nail.

Tri bikes are not unstable or dangerous. They are designed for a purpose and do their job well - the purpose it to go fast on courses where you are not riding in a pack. They maybe a little less maneuverable than roadbikes, but roadbikes are less maneuvarable than Mountain bikes, which are again less maneuverable than BMX bikes. Each is fit for a specific purpose.

If your main goal is to race an Ironman then get a Tribike. If your main goal is to join a cycling club and race in local criterium races, get a roadbike.

Tri bikes work great on most courses, until you get to very seriuos mountain climbs or technical (very narrow / twisty) routes. Even then - its open for debate. This year's Giro d'Italia (on of the 3 major global cycling racers) had a time trial leg that went up a major mountain. The field of cyclists was split - some went with the road bikes becasue of their more comfortable climbing position, some went with TT (Triathlon) bikes for their aeroproperties. I counted 8 of the top 10 guys were on TT bikes.

I'm new to the sport and bought both a road and TT bikes last fall. If I could make the decision again, I would throw more money at the TT bike and pass on the road bike. I only train for and compete in triathlons so have no need for a road bike.

As for the unstable comment, your LBS is full of crap. My Cervelo P2 handles just fine in every condition

I agree with most of the posts here. i had a road bike first and then a proper fitting tri bike. the first few rides on the tri bike took some getting used to. after that, my P2 is great for any riding that i do as far as handling and training is concerned. no worries at all with 40+ mph decents. If you plan on doing long courses (HIM and IM) then the tri bike is my vote. if you are doing olympics and shorter (and group rides), then the road bike is my vote. i could be happy with a tri bike as my only bike if i wasn;t riding with groups of roadies. if the tri bike was Di2, i would say there is no reason to have a road bike.



cheers

" aero bikes are too unstable on downhills "

What part of that statement is not BS?