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Manatee Mentors 2016 - Closed (Page 108)
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 2016-04-06 6:41 AM in reply to: 0 |
Master  8248      Eugene, Oregon Bronze member |  Subject: RE: Manatee Mentors 2016 - ClosedNope. The average fifth grader could take me down at those distances in all events. I only look "fast" if we've all been at it for at least two hours first. As for marathons, meh..... After a dozen or so, I don't particularly care if I never do another (unless decide to do full IM someday). I guess I can understand the allure if one has never done one, but in my mind, they're kind of too much of a good thing, physically and mentally. The marathon was probably my best event when I was younger, but never my favorite. It's not so much the time commitment (funny to see triathletes griping about that; in my mind, marathon training takes up about as much time as fairly committed Oly training or REALLY in--it-to-win it sprint training, and considerably less than HIM training) but the potential for injury. Some people are lucky to be able to handle the necessary volume fairly well (I've been really, really lucky in that respect, especially considering I did my first three as a teenager) but many have underlying biomechanical issues, weight issues, limited time for recovery, etc. that is going to make staying healthy really difficult. It's like anything else--it's not for everyone. I would not start marathon training unless I had no serious injury concerns (major past overuse injuries or current persistent niggles), wanted to focus pretty much solely on running (with swim/bike mainly for recovery once or twice a week), and knew I had opportunities most days to get off my feet during the day and get adequate rest. Edited by Hot Runner 2016-04-06 6:53 AM |
| 2016-04-06 7:29 AM in reply to: JJ- |
812 Katy, Texas | Subject: RE: Manatee Mentors 2016 - Closed Originally posted by JJ- Originally posted by Jet Black Originally posted by TXTriRook Hey everyone, hope the weather's starting to improve wherever you're training/racing. I hear the Northeast is finally getting the winter it missed out on this year. I just signed up for my 1st Tri of 2016 (race is next weekend, Oly distance) and the race website's comments about the swim are: "The swim is in a small, man-made lake. All distances will start together in a time trial/swim stream fashion. We will start people 1-2 at a time every 1 -2 seconds so it will be a steady stream of people." I've never heard of this before and it sounds like it could be utter chaotic. Has anyone ever done anything like this? That's your typical rolling start that Ironman has started to default to. When you pass the timing mat, your race starts. Hopefully people seed themselves accordingly, but at least in a lake there should be plenty of room to go around slow people. It's actually a pretty good way to start a race. Only bad thing is that if you see someone on the bike or the run that are in your age group, you have no idea when that person started relative to you. So you won't know how you did until the times are posted. When does the seeding actually take place? Is it just informal signs that you stand by at the swim start? Yeah, it's usually the RD breaking people up into say 20-25 minute swimmers, 25-30 minute swimmers, etc. Then in your group you talk and figure out where you fit. |
| 2016-04-06 11:02 AM in reply to: 0 |
| 812 Katy, Texas | Subject: RE: Manatee Mentors 2016 - Closed Ok, new topic. Let's talk about taper. I'm not sure I believe there's much of a point to it, at least with my experience so far. And as I inch closer to my first IM I'm starting to question the approach I should take. Should we stop increasing volume and/or intensity leading into an event to make sure our bodies aren't trying to adapt at the time of race? Sure. But to actually decrease volume/intensity seems counter productive. You've built up your fitness to where your body should be used to some volume/intensity. Just then maintaining that intensity shouldn't be that hard on your body. Decreasing it will result in lower fitness. My training peaks annual plan suggests this for the final 1.5 months: 17 hrs 17 hrs 10 hrs 15 hrs 12 hrs race week - 10 hrs (not sure if this includes the race, but I plan on probably doing 4 hrs during the week before the race) I'm thinking more: 17 17 14 16 14 race week - 4 hrs before Saturday race Thoughts? Edit: I guess what I'm suggesting is a much more sharp taper rather than a long drawn out one. You're not going to lose much fitness in a week, but you could lose a lot if you taper for a month. Edited by Jet Black 2016-04-06 11:05 AM |
| 2016-04-06 11:46 AM in reply to: Jet Black |
Master 4119 Toronto Bronze member | Subject: RE: Manatee Mentors 2016 - Closed Originally posted by Jet Black Ok, new topic. Let's talk about taper. I'm not sure I believe there's much of a point to it, at least with my experience so far. And as I inch closer to my first IM I'm starting to question the approach I should take. Should we stop increasing volume and/or intensity leading into an event to make sure our bodies aren't trying to adapt at the time of race? Sure. But to actually decrease volume/intensity seems counter productive. You've built up your fitness to where your body should be used to some volume/intensity. Just then maintaining that intensity shouldn't be that hard on your body. Decreasing it will result in lower fitness. My training peaks annual plan suggests this for the final 1.5 months: 17 hrs 17 hrs 10 hrs 15 hrs 12 hrs race week - 10 hrs (not sure if this includes the race, but I plan on probably doing 4 hrs during the week before the race) I'm thinking more: 17 17 14 16 14 race week - 4 hrs before Saturday race Thoughts? Edit: I guess what I'm suggesting is a much more sharp taper rather than a long drawn out one. You're not going to lose much fitness in a week, but you could lose a lot if you taper for a month. I guess i would ask first how closely you've been following the plan? If you have been following closely and doing well, you're not injured or anything then just follow the plan. It was designed to get you to the start healthy and ready to go. Honestly, even at 4 week out you're ready to go. You're not making any more gains so keep up the fitness. You do want to reach the start rested. You may even want that 10 hour week just to be home to do stuff that you've been neglecting, if you have ... life happens while you're IM training ... If you have been more loosely following or have found you would have preferred lots of other training or it isn't matching go for the changes but you've been putting in a lot of hard work. But don't worry about losing fitness in that time period. It's there. At that point you're maintaining what you've built. |
| 2016-04-06 12:11 PM in reply to: 0 |
Pro 6520 Bellingham, WA | Subject: RE: Manatee Mentors 2016 - Closed Tapering is a funny thing. From my experience, I've had taper weeks that I executed perfectly according to the prescribed formula involving intensity/duration and have had poor races and good races. I've had miserable taper weeks where I wasn't able to do half of what I was supposed to and again I've had bad races and good races. I rarely have maintained something close to my peak weeks for tri races but have maintained volume for running races with some success. For me, with longer running races it just felt right to keep doing what I'd been doing. It was the safer bet that maybe didn't give me a super fresh, rested feeling but it was the safest in terms of continuity of what my body was used to. I think either way you will do fine. Edited by popsracer 2016-04-06 12:13 PM |
| 2016-04-06 12:17 PM in reply to: Jet Black |
Veteran 659 East Texas | Subject: RE: Manatee Mentors 2016 - Closed Originally posted by Jet Black Ok, new topic. Let's talk about taper. I'm not sure I believe there's much of a point to it, at least with my experience so far. And as I inch closer to my first IM I'm starting to question the approach I should take. Should we stop increasing volume and/or intensity leading into an event to make sure our bodies aren't trying to adapt at the time of race? Sure. But to actually decrease volume/intensity seems counter productive. You've built up your fitness to where your body should be used to some volume/intensity. Just then maintaining that intensity shouldn't be that hard on your body. Decreasing it will result in lower fitness. My training peaks annual plan suggests this for the final 1.5 months: 17 hrs 17 hrs 10 hrs 15 hrs 12 hrs race week - 10 hrs (not sure if this includes the race, but I plan on probably doing 4 hrs during the week before the race) I'm thinking more: 17 17 14 16 14 race week - 4 hrs before Saturday race Thoughts? Edit: I guess what I'm suggesting is a much more sharp taper rather than a long drawn out one. You're not going to lose much fitness in a week, but you could lose a lot if you taper for a month. I think the other big aspect of the taper is how strong you will feel on race day. While you have a high level of fitness you have been carrying a high level of fatigue. You are so used to it by now you don't notice it. The taper is just about shedding that fatigue. I believe in reduced volume but NOT reduced intensity. I think you should keep the frequency of the workouts and the intensity of the workouts but reduce the volume of the workouts. The intensity will help you from losing too much fitness. Most Ironman taper articles that I have read suggest 3 week taper with 75% of normal volume week 3, 50% week 2, 25% race week so I agree with your 4 hours the week of the race. |
| 2016-04-06 12:22 PM in reply to: juniperjen |
Master 9705 Raleigh, NC area | Subject: RE: Manatee Mentors 2016 - Closed Originally posted by juniperjen Originally posted by Jet Black Ok, new topic. Let's talk about taper. I'm not sure I believe there's much of a point to it, at least with my experience so far. And as I inch closer to my first IM I'm starting to question the approach I should take. Should we stop increasing volume and/or intensity leading into an event to make sure our bodies aren't trying to adapt at the time of race? Sure. But to actually decrease volume/intensity seems counter productive. You've built up your fitness to where your body should be used to some volume/intensity. Just then maintaining that intensity shouldn't be that hard on your body. Decreasing it will result in lower fitness. My training peaks annual plan suggests this for the final 1.5 months: 17 hrs 17 hrs 10 hrs 15 hrs 12 hrs race week - 10 hrs (not sure if this includes the race, but I plan on probably doing 4 hrs during the week before the race) I'm thinking more: 17 17 14 16 14 race week - 4 hrs before Saturday race Thoughts? Edit: I guess what I'm suggesting is a much more sharp taper rather than a long drawn out one. You're not going to lose much fitness in a week, but you could lose a lot if you taper for a month. I guess i would ask first how closely you've been following the plan? If you have been following closely and doing well, you're not injured or anything then just follow the plan. It was designed to get you to the start healthy and ready to go. Honestly, even at 4 week out you're ready to go. You're not making any more gains so keep up the fitness. You do want to reach the start rested. You may even want that 10 hour week just to be home to do stuff that you've been neglecting, if you have ... life happens while you're IM training ... If you have been more loosely following or have found you would have preferred lots of other training or it isn't matching go for the changes but you've been putting in a lot of hard work. But don't worry about losing fitness in that time period. It's there. At that point you're maintaining what you've built. What Jen said. The idea is to be sharp an raring to go on race day. |
| 2016-04-06 3:10 PM in reply to: JJ- |
Master 6595 Rio Rancho, NM | Subject: RE: Manatee Mentors 2016 - Closed Originally posted by JJ- Originally posted by Jet Black Ok, new topic. Let's talk about taper. I'm not sure I believe there's much of a point to it, at least with my experience so far. And as I inch closer to my first IM I'm starting to question the approach I should take. Should we stop increasing volume and/or intensity leading into an event to make sure our bodies aren't trying to adapt at the time of race? Sure. But to actually decrease volume/intensity seems counter productive. You've built up your fitness to where your body should be used to some volume/intensity. Just then maintaining that intensity shouldn't be that hard on your body. Decreasing it will result in lower fitness. My training peaks annual plan suggests this for the final 1.5 months: 17 hrs 17 hrs 10 hrs 15 hrs 12 hrs race week - 10 hrs (not sure if this includes the race, but I plan on probably doing 4 hrs during the week before the race) I'm thinking more: 17 17 14 16 14 race week - 4 hrs before Saturday race Thoughts? Edit: I guess what I'm suggesting is a much more sharp taper rather than a long drawn out one. You're not going to lose much fitness in a week, but you could lose a lot if you taper for a month. I think the other big aspect of the taper is how strong you will feel on race day. While you have a high level of fitness you have been carrying a high level of fatigue. You are so used to it by now you don't notice it. The taper is just about shedding that fatigue. I believe in reduced volume but NOT reduced intensity. I think you should keep the frequency of the workouts and the intensity of the workouts but reduce the volume of the workouts. The intensity will help you from losing too much fitness. Most Ironman taper articles that I have read suggest 3 week taper with 75% of normal volume week 3, 50% week 2, 25% race week so I agree with your 4 hours the week of the race. I agree. I feel much stronger going in to a race for which I've tapered. |
| 2016-04-06 4:01 PM in reply to: rrrunner |
| Master 10208 Northern IL | Subject: RE: Manatee Mentors 2016 - Closed Originally posted by rrrunner And to make it more clear, it's not just feeling like you are stronger, but actually performing stronger at that. The big training volume will help to raise fitness up and you've certainly been seeing improvements along the way, but you can't fully access the improvement with all the fatigue still in there. You have become used to carrying it, so may not notice as much. Fitness can drop slightly over that last month, but that's where things are a balancing act. That ever so slight drop can be more than made up for by the fatigue shedding. Everything in there until race week is still double digit hours which is not insignificant.Originally posted by JJ- Originally posted by Jet Black Ok, new topic. Let's talk about taper. I'm not sure I believe there's much of a point to it, at least with my experience so far. And as I inch closer to my first IM I'm starting to question the approach I should take. Should we stop increasing volume and/or intensity leading into an event to make sure our bodies aren't trying to adapt at the time of race? Sure. But to actually decrease volume/intensity seems counter productive. You've built up your fitness to where your body should be used to some volume/intensity. Just then maintaining that intensity shouldn't be that hard on your body. Decreasing it will result in lower fitness. My training peaks annual plan suggests this for the final 1.5 months: 17 hrs 17 hrs 10 hrs 15 hrs 12 hrs race week - 10 hrs (not sure if this includes the race, but I plan on probably doing 4 hrs during the week before the race) I'm thinking more: 17 17 14 16 14 race week - 4 hrs before Saturday race Thoughts? Edit: I guess what I'm suggesting is a much more sharp taper rather than a long drawn out one. You're not going to lose much fitness in a week, but you could lose a lot if you taper for a month. I think the other big aspect of the taper is how strong you will feel on race day. While you have a high level of fitness you have been carrying a high level of fatigue. You are so used to it by now you don't notice it. The taper is just about shedding that fatigue. I believe in reduced volume but NOT reduced intensity. I think you should keep the frequency of the workouts and the intensity of the workouts but reduce the volume of the workouts. The intensity will help you from losing too much fitness. Most Ironman taper articles that I have read suggest 3 week taper with 75% of normal volume week 3, 50% week 2, 25% race week so I agree with your 4 hours the week of the race. I agree. I feel much stronger going in to a race for which I've tapered. |
| 2016-04-06 4:12 PM in reply to: Jet Black |
| Alpharetta, Georgia Bronze member | Subject: RE: Manatee Mentors 2016 - Closed Hey everyone, hope the weather's starting to improve wherever you're training/racing. I hear the Northeast is finally getting the winter it missed out on this year. I just signed up for my 1st Tri of 2016 (race is next weekend, Oly distance) and the race website's comments about the swim are: "The swim is in a small, man-made lake. All distances will start together in a time trial/swim stream fashion. We will start people 1-2 at a time every 1 -2 seconds so it will be a steady stream of people." I've never heard of this before and it sounds like it could be utter chaotic. Has anyone ever done anything like this? I've done both 70.3 (Pigman) and 140.6 (IMLOU) in this fashion and they are BY FAR my favorite types of starts! Neither of mine were seeded - Pigman was by age group and IMLOU is first come first served. But both were calm and I had nearly zero contact. HIYA MANATEES! |
| 2016-04-06 5:48 PM in reply to: 0 |
Veteran 2441 Western Australia | Subject: RE: Manatee Mentors 2016 - Closed Sorry Sean no help from me about taper as I have zero experience with that. Great to see you Lisa - how is your leg going? Janyne if you are still looking for compression socks or sleeves check outcrazycompression.com So one this point I need some input. About 3 hours after may 12k race at the end of May I have to get on a plane for a 5 hour flight to the other side of the country, someone has suggested that it would be wise to wear compression socks during the flight. What do you think? Edited by StaceyK 2016-04-06 5:50 PM |
| 2016-04-06 11:40 PM in reply to: StaceyK |
Melon Presser 52116 | Subject: RE: Manatee Mentors 2016 - Closed Originally posted by StaceyK Sorry Sean no help from me about taper as I have zero experience with that. Great to see you Lisa - how is your leg going? Janyne if you are still looking for compression socks or sleeves check outcrazycompression.com So one this point I need some input. About 3 hours after may 12k race at the end of May I have to get on a plane for a 5 hour flight to the other side of the country, someone has suggested that it would be wise to wear compression socks during the flight. What do you think? Yes. Compression hose (like old lady hose you buy at the chemist) would be even better. |
| 2016-04-07 3:05 AM in reply to: IndoIronYanti |
Veteran 2441 Western Australia | Subject: RE: Manatee Mentors 2016 - Closed Originally posted by IndoIronYanti Oh he!! no! Originally posted by StaceyK Sorry Sean no help from me about taper as I have zero experience with that. Great to see you Lisa - how is your leg going? Janyne if you are still looking for compression socks or sleeves check outcrazycompression.com So one this point I need some input. About 3 hours after may 12k race at the end of May I have to get on a plane for a 5 hour flight to the other side of the country, someone has suggested that it would be wise to wear compression socks during the flight. What do you think? Yes. Compression hose (like old lady hose you buy at the chemist) would be even better. I was thinking something cool like these (compression.JPG) Attachments ---------------- compression.JPG (17KB - 13 downloads) |
| 2016-04-07 7:24 AM in reply to: JJ- |
| 812 Katy, Texas | Subject: RE: Manatee Mentors 2016 - Closed Originally posted by JJ- While you have a high level of fitness you have been carrying a high level of fatigue. You are so used to it by now you don't notice it. Thanks everyone, and I think this is a good point that I wasn't considering. I also like the idea of 75% -> 50% -> 25%. I'm going to see how I can plan those weeks out using that philosophy and see where it lands. |
| 2016-04-07 8:05 AM in reply to: 0 |
Champion 14677 Bronze member | Subject: RE: Manatee Mentors 2016 - Closed Hey all an AWOL fly-by. I am home from the non-race, Vacation of Illness. Of course, to top things off, I am still not well. I can eat, bland stuff, but food non-the-less. But I have chills and aches. So.... viral something? I do not know. I am so damn far behind in my training I am not sure I can catch up. I will, however, try. This is a huge volume week. I am gonna take the rest of it and make an "as much volume as I can do without hurting myself more" week and then see where I am later. I have determined I am race-cursed. Heck, at the Ocala race, it was all I could do to get up and just watch my friends race. I would have died trying it. as an aside, it is really sad that the HITS races seem to be very diminished on all levels with the change in race director. I can only speak for this race, but having been before and now, the difference is night and day. Sad because it is such a great opportunity for all levels of folks to get to race at the same time. Edited by ceilidh 2016-04-07 8:09 AM |
| 2016-04-07 8:50 AM in reply to: IndoIronYanti |
| Pennsylvania | Subject: RE: Manatee Mentors 2016 - Closed Originally posted by IndoIronYanti Originally posted by StaceyK Sorry Sean no help from me about taper as I have zero experience with that. Great to see you Lisa - how is your leg going? Janyne if you are still looking for compression socks or sleeves check outcrazycompression.com So one this point I need some input. About 3 hours after may 12k race at the end of May I have to get on a plane for a 5 hour flight to the other side of the country, someone has suggested that it would be wise to wear compression socks during the flight. What do you think? Yes. Compression hose (like old lady hose you buy at the chemist) would be even better. Yes. Not that I fly that frequently, but when I do I wear compression socks. Heck, I even wear them for really long drives sometimes. I'd pick regular socks over calf sleeves though. I'd be concerned that you would get fluid retention below the bottom of the sleeve at your ankle. |
| 2016-04-07 9:10 AM in reply to: IndoIronYanti |
Master 9705 Raleigh, NC area | Subject: RE: Manatee Mentors 2016 - Closed Originally posted by IndoIronYanti Originally posted by StaceyK Sorry Sean no help from me about taper as I have zero experience with that. Great to see you Lisa - how is your leg going? Janyne if you are still looking for compression socks or sleeves check outcrazycompression.com So one this point I need some input. About 3 hours after may 12k race at the end of May I have to get on a plane for a 5 hour flight to the other side of the country, someone has suggested that it would be wise to wear compression socks during the flight. What do you think? Yes. Compression hose (like old lady hose you buy at the chemist) would be even better. Just look for graduated compression -- whether it's the fun and fancy ones or the pharmacy brands like Futuro. Thee Crazy Compression ones claim "Graduated Compression 15-20mmhg." |
| 2016-04-07 11:54 AM in reply to: StaceyK |
Pro 6520 Bellingham, WA | Subject: RE: Manatee Mentors 2016 - Closed Originally posted by StaceyK Sorry Sean no help from me about taper as I have zero experience with that. Great to see you Lisa - how is your leg going? Janyne if you are still looking for compression socks or sleeves check outcrazycompression.com So one this point I need some input. About 3 hours after may 12k race at the end of May I have to get on a plane for a 5 hour flight to the other side of the country, someone has suggested that it would be wise to wear compression socks during the flight. What do you think? I think it would be a good idea. After my last marathon, I had to fly home and was a little concerned about DVT so wore compression. In addition, I read that it is good to get up and walk around as much as possible. Also to do lower leg exercises and stretches while sitting. |
| 2016-04-07 1:22 PM in reply to: Jet Black |
Veteran 659 East Texas | Subject: RE: Manatee Mentors 2016 - Closed Originally posted by Jet Black Originally posted by JJ- While you have a high level of fitness you have been carrying a high level of fatigue. You are so used to it by now you don't notice it. Thanks everyone, and I think this is a good point that I wasn't considering. I also like the idea of 75% -> 50% -> 25%. I'm going to see how I can plan those weeks out using that philosophy and see where it lands. Just remind me what I said when I start tapering or Boulder in 4 months  Ironman taper = you start questioning everything! |
| 2016-04-07 1:35 PM in reply to: JJ- |
Master 4119 Toronto Bronze member | Subject: RE: Manatee Mentors 2016 - Closed Originally posted by JJ- Originally posted by Jet Black Just remind me what I said when I start tapering or Boulder in 4 months Originally posted by JJ- While you have a high level of fitness you have been carrying a high level of fatigue. You are so used to it by now you don't notice it. Thanks everyone, and I think this is a good point that I wasn't considering. I also like the idea of 75% -> 50% -> 25%. I'm going to see how I can plan those weeks out using that philosophy and see where it lands. Ironman taper = you start questioning everything! Completely! Let the self-doubt and obsession begin! :D |
| 2016-04-07 1:47 PM in reply to: JJ- |
| Seattle | Subject: RE: Manatee Mentors 2016 - Closed There is no way I can catch up but I just wanted to pop in and say hello. So, hello! I had a snow/sun/snow sandwich for my birthday. I did an all womens backcountry tour (IE a trek basically) with some avalanche experts which was both educational and amazingly fun snowboarding
Then J and I went to Kaui. We camped for part of it, did a catamaran tour on the Na Pili coast where we saw whale, turtles and dolphins as well as doing some snorkeling surfing etc.
Then I did a backcountry hut to hut adventure on my actual birthday with some friends.
Of course there was lots and lots of running especially since I am in marathon mode. And speaking of, I have a 15K tune-up in the calendar (per our discussion) and a consult with a coach.
I have had a lot less availability lately as we've got some big things at work going on (good things!) I will be doing a 5 country blitz in May (China, Hong Kong, Singapore, Thailand, UAE) So, even less availability. Looking forward to some fun international running though. I am training consistently and generally "around" but my time is just limited. As always you can keep up with me through my training log (just the basic training info, not much detail) and instagram. |
| 2016-04-07 3:30 PM in reply to: Asalzwed |
Veteran 1900 Southampton, Ontario | Subject: RE: Manatee Mentors 2016 - Closed This showed up in my Facebook feed so I though I would share. I did my 97th ride this morning (catching up) and have my 98th ride tonight. (e1ec5050cdde646ef1f13256675150f8.jpg) Attachments ---------------- e1ec5050cdde646ef1f13256675150f8.jpg (46KB - 11 downloads) |
| 2016-04-07 3:45 PM in reply to: DaveL |
| Master 10208 Northern IL | Subject: RE: Manatee Mentors 2016 - Closed Originally posted by DaveL This showed up in my Facebook feed so I though I would share. I did my 97th ride this morning (catching up) and have my 98th ride tonight. What's your day off? |
| 2016-04-07 3:49 PM in reply to: brigby1 |
| 812 Katy, Texas | Subject: RE: Manatee Mentors 2016 - Closed |
| 2016-04-07 4:53 PM in reply to: JJ- |
| 270 | Subject: RE: Manatee Mentors 2016 - Closed Johnathan- I'm meeting Kirk tonight. He's helping lead our group ride tonight. I've heard he's really talented and has lots of experience. I'm looking forward to it. |
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